RMMGA postings on air travel with guitars (1996 - 9 Sep 2001)

136 Messages in 38 Threads:

Checking in guitars [2]

From: Randall Newcomb <newcomb@winternet...>
Subject: Re: Checking in guitars
Date: Wed, 04 Sep 1996 21:57:09 -0500
Organization: Winternet (Minneapolis, Minnesota)

Techniques that I have used that have been successful:

I had one instrument slightly mangled. It went from Germany to Canada
with no problems. It went from Canada to Minneapolis with no problems.
On the trip from Minneapolis to Sioux Falls (a 45 minute flight) someone
took dancing lessons on it.

Since then...

For years I used an ugly purple Anvil case for my Martin D-35. I would
check it with a skycap because the airlines sometimes wanted to charge an
oversize bag fee. No tragic incidents with the Anvil but my arms are 3
inches longer because of the weight of the case.

Lately I've just been using the regular Martin case for my wife's D-25K2,
but I always try to take it on as carry on. The case will fit in the
overhead storage of most planes (DC-9 or larger). Take a seat towards the
back since passengers in these seats are allowed to board first (usually)
before all the overhead storage fills up. If there is absolutely no room
then you can (shudder) hand it to a flight attendant who hand-carries it
down below. Never let it ride the conveyor.

Warning: 757s NEVER have enough overhead storage.

- Randall

--
Carpe Cavy! (Seize the guinea pig!)
http://www.winternet.com/~newcomb


From: Rick Brown <rickcrna@xmission...>
Subject: Re: Checking in guitars
Date: Thu, 05 Sep 1996 17:19:55 -0600
Organization: XMission Internet (801 539 0900)

In article <50lbdc$<4ao@news...>>, <stang@hal-pc...> wrote:

> <weet@aisb...> (Wee Tan) wrote:
>
> >Has anyone ever had bad experiences after checking in a guitar at the
> >airport? The reason I'm asking is that I'll be flying in a months time
> >and may have to do so. I am feeling nervous about Godzilla the baggage
> >handler (no insult intended to any baggage handler). Even if the
> >hardshell case was absolutely rigid and inpenetrable, would the shocks
> >recieved from rough handling physically damage the guitar inside? I know
> >that there have been threads about this before but this time perhaps we
> >could share any negative experiences any of us have had. Hopefully
> >nobody replies to this message!
>
> The only guitar I've ever checked was an Ovation, & I've checked it
> several times, never any problem. The rigid fitted case probably
> makes a difference, since the guitar can't move around at all in it.
> However, just because I haven't had any problems does not mean you
> won't. Bad things can happen any time.
>
> It all depends on how much you value your guitar. If you love it
> enough, you might buy it a ticket so it can have its own seat, or you
> can check it & take your chances.
>
> With the airlines, there are no guarantees.

Hi there!

     When I fly with my guitar, I always insist on taking it on the plane
as a carry-on. Most of the time the case fits in the overhead compartment
except on L1011 and DC-10 aircraft. Then I ask (beg) the flight attendant
to store the guitar in the closet where garment bags are kept. One time,
it even flew in the cockpit, much to my surprise. On smaller commuter
aircraft, the only solution is to have the guitar hand checked to the
baggage compartment and hope and pray it is ok. Delta Airlines has been
particularly good about handling my guitar as a carry-on. So far, no
problems. <knocking on wood>

Rick

--
rick

Airline Overhead Bins [11]
From: Stuart Clemons <Stuart_Clemons@lotus...>
Subject: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 08:47:36 -0400
Organization: Lotus Development Corporation

Hi all:

Just flew on a 757-200. The overhead bins are very roomy. Can easily
fit a full size guitar. I travelled with my Green Mountain Traveler
guitar which I stored in the overhead with no problems or hassles.

Anyone have overhead bin size information for other planes ?

<Stuart_Clemons@lotus...>

No spams please.


From: Shoreline Acoustic Music <samusic@samusic...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 13:59:24 GMT
Organization: West.Net Communications

Stuart Clemons <<Stuart_Clemons@lotus...>> wrote:

>Hi all:

>Just flew on a 757-200. The overhead bins are very roomy. Can easily
>fit a full size guitar. I travelled with my Green Mountain Traveler
>guitar which I stored in the overhead with no problems or hassles.

>Anyone have overhead bin size information for other planes ?

I just flew round trip to Salt Lake City (without a water landing)
with my full sized guitar in it's hard shell case and it fit nicely in
an overhead bin of a DC-10. Despite the size of the overhead bins,
the guitar did not meet the airline's "size" requirements. I was told
I needed to check my guitar at the gate and that it would be awaiting
me at the gate upon my arrival. On the way to SLC, I was instructed
to hand it to a steward/stewardess when I got on the plane (I didn't
which is why I know about the guitar fitting in the bin). They were
evidently smarter on the way back and took the guitar from me at the
gate which gave me some concern but it was waiting for me when I got
off the plane. However, since David Wilcox's guitar was ripped of at
an airport recently, I'm still concerned about the best way to travel
with a guitar so any tips from rmmga-ers will be useful. While the
overhead bin, etc. may be big enough, size isn't everything.

Chuck


From: Ken Ewing <kene@sequent...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: 30 Apr 1997 16:22:28 GMT
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.

In article <<33673F68.907@lotus...>>,
Stuart Clemons <<Stuart_Clemons@lotus...>> wrote:
>Hi all:
>
>Just flew on a 757-200. The overhead bins are very roomy. Can easily
>fit a full size guitar. I travelled with my Green Mountain Traveler
>guitar which I stored in the overhead with no problems or hassles.
>
>Anyone have overhead bin size information for other planes ?

I've flown a number of times across the U.S. and overseas. American
airlines (i.e.; airlines in American, not just the airline called
"American") all seem to have plenty of room in the overhead bins
(at least all the airlines I've been on). I've flown on 727s, 737s,
757s, 767s with a guitar. Even my jumbo fits fine. Only once on an
American airline was I not allowed to put the guitar in an overhead
bin, and then I was asked to put the guitar in a little "coat nook"
near the front of the plane next to the door. Didn't bother me to do
it, but I did wonder if some other passenger might pick it up before
I got to the door on the way off the plane.

European airlines are a different story. I've only flown on Lufthansa
with a guitar, and they definitely do not allow guitars as carry-on.
The overhead bins are maybe 24" wide and are intended to take objects
maybe the size of a briefcase. I was required to check the guitar
as baggage. They did hand-carry the guitar to the baggage-handling
area rather than send it down the chute. The guitar came through fine
without damage.

Here are a few tips I've learned about flying with a guitar:

 o  Loosen the strings to reduce the stress on the neck.  
 o  Use the guitar case as an "overflow" suitcase.  I usually pack 
     T-shirts, towels, handkerchiefs, or whatever around the neck 
     and even thinly across the top of the guitar.  
 o  If your guitar has a soundhole pickup, remove the pickup.  It's 
     possible the pickup could come loose or stress the top if the 
     case is jarred severely.  Also, If your guitar has an onboard preamp 
     for a pickup, remove the battery.  
 o  A friend of mine actually wraps duct tape around neck portion of 
     the case before checking the guitar (he checks his rather than brings 
     it on as carry-on).  
  Ken Ewing 
  Sequent Computer Systems, Inc. 
  Beaverton, Oregon 
  kene@sequent.com 
  ...!uunet!sequent!kene 
----------------------------------------------------------------------


From: <mike@cellbio...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 1997 10:03:28 -0500
Organization: Washington University in St. Louis

In article <5k7j6u$<kgn@daffy...>>, <samusic@samusic...> (Shoreline
Acoustic Music) wrote:

However, since David Wilcox's guitar was ripped of at
> an airport recently, I'm still concerned about the best way to travel
> with a guitar so any tips from rmmga-ers will be useful. While the
> overhead bin, etc. may be big enough, size isn't everything.
>

I travel by air extensively, and the overhead compartments of most types
of planes cannot accomodate a full-sized guitar or even most smaller
guitars, including a baby taylor in its hard case. The only travel guitar
I know of that will fit in any overhead compartment is the Martin
Backpacker. Even if you fly on a plane that can theoretically accomodate
a full-size guitar, a guitar is larger than airline regulations allow for
a carry-on item. The airline has every right to prevent you from taking it
on board and forcing you to stow it in the freight compartment. Most
airlines will enforce this rule vigorously, with the possible exception of
uncrowded flights. Then, you risk damage and possible theft.

People who must travel with their full-size guitars usually buy a ticket
for their guitar or use one of the specialty guitar cases designed for air
travel. Of course, in the latter case the chance of theft remains. There
is no perfect solution unless you can afford an extra ticket for your
instrument.


From: <ap201172@brownvm...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: 30 Apr 1997 17:22:15 GMT
Organization: Brown University

Last summer I flew in a Fokker 100 from Charlotte to Providence with
both a Gibson SG and Advanced Jumbo acoustic in the overhead
compartment. No one at the airlines (US Air) hassled me about them and
they both fit fine.

In October I brought home a Gibson J-200 (Arlington to Pittsburg to
Providence) in the overhead compartment. That one barely fit but again
no hassle from US Air and I even changed planes! I've never checked a
guitar or had one taken away. I try to be discrete (how discrete can
you be with a big J-200 case?) and act like I'm doing what I always do.
YMMV.

E. Shoaf


From: Miles <m.storey@!!virgin.net>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: Thu, 01 May 1997 00:01:28 +0100
Organization: Brighton Backpackers!

I fly with my guitar pretty often and have never had a problem with
having to check it in as luggage, if they hassle you just moan about how
expensive it is, they won't know, and there's always somewhere to put
it. When it won't fit onto the overhead bins ask to have it put with the
coats, there's a big cupboard at the back which is perfect. I flew
Lufthansa last autumn and while the overhead bins were too small they
put the guitar with the coats for me.

I just got back from New York and was carrying my Taylor in a big
hardcase which fitted easily into the overhead bins on a new 747-400
Virgin Atlantic. (by the way they have the best entertainment system,
every seat has a big tv in the back and you can choose from 13 movies
and 8 other channels and 15 Nintendo games, if you like that kind of
thing, and there's a phone on every seat, all in economy!)

I feel that it just isn't worth the risk to check in a guitar, who knows
what goes on.... Always approach the attendants and say "they told me
you could....." at every stage of checking in.

miles


From: Waldo Wollrabe <disguise@teleport...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: Fri, 02 May 1997 02:13:49 -0700
Organization: NO DISGUISE

Stuart Clemons wrote:
>
> Hi all:
>
> Just flew on a 757-200. The overhead bins are very roomy. Can easily
> fit a full size guitar. I travelled with my Green Mountain Traveler
> guitar which I stored in the overhead with no problems or hassles.
>
> Anyone have overhead bin size information for other planes ?
>
> <Stuart_Clemons@lotus...>
>
> No spams please.

I have flown many many airlines, and most will allow it to go in the
overhead bins. They will definitely allow it if it is in a soft gig bag.
I have flown my electric all over in a soft gig bag. The only thing is
that I make sure some bozo with a 40lb breifcase dosn't slam it down on
my guitar. Make sure it's in last.
Some airlines had no problem with a hardshell case, Martin Air was
really helpfull. They allowed the Hard shell case and a 6 space anvil
case that they sent down and stored in the Galley for me.
The worst experience I had was in Oslo Norway flying to Stockholm
Sweden. They would not let me carry on the guitar, but they allowed me
to walk down to the tarmac and hand it personally to the guy loading the
plan. He took it and placed it carefully in the plan. The problem was
when we got to Stockholm, all the luggage came out, except the guitar.
All the people had left baggage claim, and no guitar. I was quite upset,
We had a major gig with Bruce Cocburn and I needed my axe. We called
security and they went out on the tarmac and found it stashed away on a
luggage cart. So I got it and the gig was great. From now on I always
try to carry it on in a gig bag and check my hard shell case like a
suitcase. If you call the airlines ahead of time they will usually
give you the policy. But a gig bag usually works.


From: M.DeLalla/Falling Mountain Music <fallmtn@mnsinc...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: Fri, 2 May 1997 06:58:44 -0400
Organization: Falling Mountain Music

Last summer I had the opportunity to make six different connections in a
two week period, all on Air France. Before leaving, I asked other touring
friends how they handle the carry-on issue. They fell into two camps:
1. Those who felt safest placing the guitar in a gig bag for overhead
storage, while the hardshell case goes to the luggage compartment.
2. Those who did as Stuart Clemons did in Oslo--personally carry it down
the tarmac to the luggage compartment.
I tried a hibrid of the two. First, the guitar in question is a Lowden
S-23. I brought down all the strings to the point of no tension. Then, I
packed the headstock area with extra socks, etc. This is the place where
most damage happens-at the headstock/neck. I then placed the hardshell
case in a weatherproof casecover, which allowed me to pack even more
towels, socks, etc. between it and the hardshell.
Then, at every connection, I asked the desk attendant if I could bring it
on. Had they said no, I would then ask to walk it to the tarmac, it now
being packed for the rigors of travel. In EVERY instance, the Air France
folks were most helpful and friendly. The Lowden rode overhead with me,
in a hardshell. The moral of this long posting: the airlines know they
are held in contempt for past sins by those of us who fly with
instruments. They are now trying to make amends by going the extra mile,
as it were. Air France gets my undying patronage. Any other stories
about specific airlines?
--
Michael DeLalla
Falling Mountain Music
<fallmtn@mnsinc...>

> Waldo Wollrabe <<disguise@teleport...>> wrote in article
<<3369B04D.7BB0@teleport...>>...
> Stuart Clemons wrote:
> >
> > Hi all:
> >
> > Just flew on a 757-200. The overhead bins are very roomy. Can easily
> > fit a full size guitar. I travelled with my Green Mountain Traveler
> > guitar which I stored in the overhead with no problems or hassles.
> >
> > Anyone have overhead bin size information for other planes ?
> >
> > <Stuart_Clemons@lotus...>


From: El McMeen <mcmeens@mtlakes...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: 2 May 1997 12:56:21 GMT
Organization: MHVNet

.
> > Stuart Clemons wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi all:
> > >
> > > Just flew on a 757-200. The overhead bins are very roomy. Can easily
> > > fit a full size guitar. I travelled with my Green Mountain Traveler
> > > guitar which I stored in the overhead with no problems or hassles.
> > >
> > > Anyone have overhead bin size information for other planes ?
> > >
> > > <Stuart_Clemons@lotus...>
>
I try to carry my guitar onto the plane. Frankly, I wouldn't

gamble by going with a gig bag; if the plane overheads get

too filled and some stuff must be checked, you will be at risk

in checking a gig bag. Perhaps this is obvious....

Re: size of overheads, the only problem I recollect having is

with the overheads on the Airbus, which I recall are small.

Would someone please advise on this?

El
---------------
Subject:

             Re: Airline Overhead Bins
        Date: 
             Mon, 5 May 1997 16:53:47 -0400
       From: 
             "M.DeLalla/Falling Mountain Music" <fallmtn@mnsinc.com>
Organization:
             Falling Mountain Music
  Newsgroups: 
             rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic
  References: 
             1

I travelled via Airbus last summer. The overhead bin wasn't a problem for
my guitar. I agree with El--I wouldn't want the risk of sending a gig bag
through luggage if for some reason it didn't fit into the overhead bin due
to too many other bags
--
Michael DeLalla
Falling Mountain Music
<fallmtn@mnsinc...>


From: Jtodhardin <jtodhardin@aol...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: 8 May 1997 04:23:18 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

I may be spoiled because I live in the USA and only fly domestic, but I
fly maybe 20 times a year and have had no problem with my guitar. I
usually fly Southwest or American and I am always allowed to preboard and
the overhead bins have always been large enough ( I have a Martin 000 w/ a
hardshell case). The only problem I have is when I have to fly a prop
plane and even then I am allowed to carry my guitar to the plane where it
is hand loaded and then it is waiting for me by the plane when I get off.

Tod


From: RalphPatt <ralphpatt@aol...>
Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
Date: 8 May 1997 18:44:28 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Subject: Re: Airline Overhead Bins
From: <jtodhardin@aol...> (Jtodhardin)
Date: 8 May 1997 04:23:18 GMT
Message-ID: <<19970508042200.AAA11656@ladder01...>>

<<I may be spoiled because I live in the USA and only fly domestic, but I
fly maybe 20 times a year and have had no problem with my guitar. I
usually fly Southwest or American and I am always allowed to preboard and
the overhead bins have always been large enough>>

The problem is not the large planes, but the small commuter planes. Most
of them
insist on putting your guitar in the plane's back luggage compartment when
you get to the boarding staircase. Usually they will put it on carefully
(if you ask) but when you get to your destination, King Kong is often
unloading the baggage. One notable exception is Atlanta to
Nashville...they understand guitars.

Ralph

Guitars on Planes
From: JFoxMusic <jfoxmusic@aol...>
Subject: Re: Guitars on Planes
Date: 13 Apr 1998 05:22:52 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

>The best case, without a doubt, is the Calton. I travel a huge amouint each
>year and I can honestly say that I sleep easy on the flight knowing that my
>guitars are safe in the baggage compartment in their super-reinforced calton
>cases.
>By the by....about ten years ago I was playing at the Galax Fiddlers'
>Convention and a pickup truck accidentaly backed right over a calton case
>containing my '37 00-18H. Put a nasty graze on the case....but the guitar was
>fine!
>John Pearse.

John,
This is a touching story, but it's not good enough for me. I've been dealing
with the perils of touring with instruments since the early '70s and I only use
trunks. When I have to take a valuable acoustic, it goes in the Calton, and
then into a trunk.
Why do I do this?
Because several things can cause damage. The Calton may do a good job
protecting against punctures and crushing, but what about shock. Shock will
transfer from a tight case, right into the instrument. Like if it is dropped
off a truck, for instance. It might not even show up on the outside of the
case, but the headstock could crack, or various parts and braces could break or
come loose. The foam lined trunk helps protect against this kind of shock, I
think. Also, the case-in-the-trunk method will help regarding severe changes in
temperature, humidity, pressure. Most of my instruments travel directly in the
trunks without cases.
I haven't seen it all, but I've seen a lot. The following, you can bet on:
1) They won't always let you carry on a guitar case. Period. No matter how
polite you are, or how much you beg, or how much you swear at them.
2) If you travel enough, you will witness a broken instrument caused by
improper handling.
Jim Fox

Airline Travel (Again) [3]
From: Brad Sheasby <bshe6290@stu...>
Subject: Re: Airline Travel (Again)
Date: 15 Apr 1998 21:11:01 GMT
Organization: ORU

	Last summer I traveled (coach class) with my dreadnought to Brazil, 
Uruguay, Colombia, and South Africa, and I carried it with me on every
flight(16 in all). I never once asked if I could. I just carried it on the
plane like I new what I was doing. Only once in South Africa did I have a
problem, but they let it on after some "dicussion". It ended up getting its own
seat w/ seatbelt! (managers aim to please) My case (SKB deluxe HS) fit in all
the overhead bins, although you'll definitely have to check it through on the
Saab Turboprop(limited space). I'm not saying this will work or should work for
everyone, but I'm going to continue to carry it on until they say not to!

-Brad Sheasby

>
>> Has anyone had experience with Northwest Airlines? I have a show in
>> Minn/St. Paul next week and I am uncertain about how they will handle my
>> request to carry on a Santa Cruz Dreadnought size case. One of the
>> planes I need to take is something made by Saab and I imagine it will be
>> small. The others are 727, DC9 and Airbus 320.
>
>
>Rarely will any airline allow a full-sized guitar to be carried on board,
>even if you are traveling first class. They have tightened up on this
>over the past couple of years.


From: Jim Dunn <jimdunn@home...>
Subject: Re: Airline Travel (Again)
Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:14:22 -0700
Organization: @Home Network

Saul,

I've flown with my guitar many times on the Saab, and there's no way I
know of that your guitar (or my smaller classical) will fit in the cabin
of the aircraft. What you should do is handcarry the guitar to the
loading stairs and hand it to the person responsible for gate-checked
luggage (there's always lots of it on this type of plane). They'll put
it in last and take it off first. It should be available for you at the
bottom of the stairs when you step off at your destination. I've had a
lot of luck with this approach.

Jim Dunn

Saul Rosenthal wrote:
>
> Has anyone had experience with Northwest Airlines? I have a show in
> Minn/St. Paul next week and I am uncertain about how they will handle my
> request to carry on a Santa Cruz Dreadnought size case. One of the
> planes I need to take is something made by Saab and I imagine it will be
> small. The others are 727, DC9 and Airbus 320.
>
> Any advice would be appreciated.
>
> Saul


From: Russell Letson <rletson@cloudnet...>
Subject: Re: Airline Travel (Again)
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 05:01:06 GMT
Organization: Cloudnet

Jim Dunn's right about getting anything bigger than a laptop onto one
of Northwest's Saabs--but I've found them very nice about
gate-checking (planeside checking, really--you drop off and pick up at
the plane's stairway). They tell me that the cargo area is pressurized
and heated.

As for other Northwest situations, they've gone to the "two bag" rule,
but they let me waltz onto several flights recently with my Baby
Taylor hard case. Do note that NW flies a lot of older 727s and some
Douglas aircraft (D-9s?) with really dinky overheads--even the Baby
was a tough squeeze on one flight.

--
Russell Letson
<rletson@cloudnet...>
http://www.cloudnet.com/~rletson

New Airline Regulations [2]
From: JOHNPEARSE <johnpearse@aol...>
Subject: New Airline Regulations
Date: 01 May 1998 21:44:09 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

This just arrived in my eMail. I hope Mr. Rivinus doesn't mind me reposting it.
It affects each and every one of us. Let's act! NOW!
John Pearse.

OK folks:

Anybody tried to take a violin on an airplane recently? A violin case is
now considered oversized and MUST be stored in the hold along with the dogs
and cats, or you have to buy an extra seat for it. These rules have come
down from the FAA so it's all airlines. I just went through two nightmare
experiences and at least, as a fiddle paster, I can take the strings and
post down. But how about players?

Write your congresspeople, any editors you know, anybody of influence.
I've written an arts editor at the NY Times whom I know and have written to
Mary VanClay at Strings. Someone with connections should write Strad and
any other important person who might have influence. This is going to
adversely affect every string player who ever uses an airplane.

David Rivinus


From: Saul Rosenthal <saul@adldenver...>
Subject: Re: New Airline Regulations
Date: Mon, 04 May 1998 08:34:33 -0700
Organization: Anti-Defamation League

Carl Christensen wrote:
>
> On 01 May 1998 21:44:09 GMT, <johnpearse@aol...> (JOHNPEARSE) wrote:
> >This just arrived in my eMail. I hope Mr. Rivinus doesn't mind me reposting it.
> >It affects each and every one of us. Let's act! NOW!
>
> Oh yeah, the airlines are getting tough as hell about it now. I just
> was out in Albuquerque on a job interview, and a fellow passenger had
> a nice Collings in a Calton case. The flight attendants practically
> had him in tears because they would not let him bring it on board and
> insisted he check it in.
>
> They're really getting strict on overhead luggage requirements these
> days; part of the fallout of the "price wars" I guess. I think they
> finally relented but the poor guy was beside himself about his $6K
> guitar in checked luggage (can't blame him). I'm not going to take my
> guitars on flights anymore, until I get a Papoose or Baby Taylor (if
> that isn't too big now :-(
>
> --
> Carl Christensen
> Philadelphia, PA USA
> E-mail: <carl@navpoint...> Web: http://www.navpoint.com/~carl

This is a recurring theme and I think it's blown way out of proportion.
I took four flights last weekend - a DC9, Airbus 320, 727 and Saab 740.
I carried my dreadnought onto the first three (using a gig bag) without
a single comment from anyone, except a request to play on two flights.
The Saab, which is a 30 passenger plane, has no overhead space but they
let me carry on and put it under some empty seats. So far I don;t see
anything changing.

Saul R

Travelling with a good guitar
From: Re davide <redavide@aol...>
Subject: Re: Travelling with a good guitar
Date: 15 Jun 1998 19:35:14 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

>I am going to be away from home for a month. I am flying to my
>destination. I am bringing a good guitar. My question to the group is..
>should I take the guitar on the plane (it would go in with the regular
>luggage compartment) OR should I ship it to my final destination via
>UPS? I have heard so many horror stories about planes, I thought this
>may be an alternative..

I am an attorney and a guitarist. As an attorney I represent several airlines
and I have experience with lost/damaged cargo and baggage claims filed in
court. If the airline forces you to check your guitar, IT IS IMPERATIVE to
declare the value of the guitar; make sure that it is insured for that amount
and get proof of the insured amount (this may cost a little extra, but it's
worth the expense). If you don't do this, the airline's liability is limited
by the tariff it files according to federal law -- for domestic flights, this
amount is usually limited to $1,250.00. Without the additional insurance,
you'll never receive more than this regardless of what happens to the guitar.
If possible it is always a good idea to have proof of the guitar's value --
sales receipt, appraisal, photos, etc.

     Additionally, if you must check a guitar do a "gate check" -- this is
where you bring the guitar to the airplane door when you're boarding and hand
the guitar to a handler who will put it on last so it will be on the top of
everyone else's luggage with less chance of getting damaged.

     Lastly, if the guitar is damaged or lost, make sure it is reported
immediately and that ALL necessary steps for reimbursement are followed -- read
the forms very, very carefully.

     As a guitarist, I always travel with a Martin Backpacker because I don't
trust any airline with my good guitars. It's so small, there is no need to
check it. It only cost around $175.00 and for the money and size has excellent
intonation and acceptable sound. It will keep your fingers in shape and you
can play anything you'd play on a full-size guitar. I like it so much,
sometimes I even play it at home instead of a regular guitar -- the different
sound is inspiring and you'll probably find yourself coming up with new ideas.

Query: Carrying guitar on Delta Airlines?
From: Mark Wegner <markwegner@webtv...>
Subject: Re: Query: Carrying guitar on Delta Airlines?
Date: Sat, 20 Jun 1998 22:39:02 -0500
Organization: WebTV Subscriber

Oddly enough, I picked up my Delta tickets yesterday. I asked if it was
allowed to gate check and the answer was absolutely not. Some guitarists
have told me to carry it on to the plane, and they would be forced to
gate check it, but I have to transfer planes and I am just chicken to do
it. I checked on insurance, and you will have to pay for it at the time
you check your guitar. You get $1200 base. To insure your guitar for
$2000, it will be $20, $3000, it will be $30, and so forth. That is each
way. I have decided I AM gonna take the chance and check it with my
luggage. Taylor cases don't lock (at least mine doesn't) so I am gonna
duck tape the case.

Wish me luck.

Mark

buying airline ticket for guitar [2]
From: Shrimer <ftshrimer@bc...>
Subject: Re: buying airline ticket for guitar
Date: Tue, 07 Jul 1998 21:24:19 -0700
Organization: BCTEL Advanced Communications

I just talked to Canadian Airlines yesterday about traveling with guitar
(am going to Chicago next week, thought about taking acoustic with).
They told me unequivocally that it's going to have to go "down below".
No gate checking. Or, I could buy it a seat, too.

It won't even SEE the darn movie!!

- Fred

Adrian Legg wrote:
>
> In article <<35a00439.1373768624@pro...>> Al Sato,
> <please@nospam...> writes:
> >Subject: buying airline ticket for guitar
> >From: Al Sato, <please@nospam...>
> >Date: Sun, 05 Jul 1998 22:58:00 GMT
> >>Folks,
> >
> >Does anyone have any experience with buying an airline ticket for your
> >guitar?
>
> I had so much hassle from Canadian airports
> handling the US carrier I use most that in the
> end I refused to do any Canadian gigs that I had
> to fly to unless whoever wanted me there bought
> the guitar a ticket, as was suggested by
> Canadian ground-staff during some of the rows.
> I flew to Toronto with an extra ticket for
> G.Legg. I didn't get its meals. The ticket was
> bought by the booker, so I don't know details.
> It still ended up in the overhead.
> You may like to check out rec.travel.airlines -
> cabin baggage rules are tightening up as
> passengers complain about stuff falling on them.
> Also bear in mind the Boeing 777 has a max.
> overhead length of 37.5 inches, and closet space
> is reduced.
>
> http://www.roe.ac.uk/mjpwww/legghead.htm


From: Gerardo <ghernan@cts...>
Subject: Re: buying airline ticket for guitar
Date: 9 Jul 1998 20:14:13 GMT
Organization: CTS Network Services

I had the chance to speak to Phil Keaggy this weekend. He usually travels
with his guitar inside a gigbag and carries it with him on the plane.
Apparently this last time he had a little bit of trouble. They did not
want him to board with the gig bag and he said "well, I will stay and
catch the next flight, but I would like to talk to your supervisor about
this, please". After this they agreed to allow him to bring it with him.

 He told me that it is getting harder and harder to carry your guitar with
you, but he has had MANY bad experiences whenever he checks it in. Last
time he did a gig with his Parker Fly, he checked it in and it got
damaged. Now he only carries one acoustic guitar along with his rack
(jamman and compressor) on the plane and that way he is sure he's got all
he needs for his gig on the plane, right by his side.

I personally have never had a problem bringing my guitar with me, but maybe
I have just been lucky.

Willie Nelson buys a seat for his old Martin hole model.

Gerardo

P.S. By the way and with all due respect: I recently saw Willie Nelson
perform on TV and his guitar sounded horrible and very out of tune. Matter
of fact, the two or three times that I have seen him on TV, his guitar has
sounded bad, really bad.
Anybody else noticed this?

Martin Guitar Cases - fit for air travel? [3]
From: Larry Pattis <abuse@127...>
Subject: Re: Martin Guitar Cases - fit for air travel?
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 12:24:00 -0600
Organization: XMission http://www.xmission.com/

In article <<360A8628.F15CFC4E@Juno...>>, "George C. Kaschner"
<<GeoKasch@Juno...>> wrote:

>
> I wonder how many times we'll say "Gate Check" before people start
believing it.
>
> Go for the tone,
>
> George

The best thing about Gate Check/Gate Claim is that if you brazenly disply
your Gate Check claim tag attached to the handle of your guitar case as you
are handing your ticket to the gate/jetway person during boarding, they
will simply "assume" that you will be allowing the airline baggage person
to grab your guitar (at that door midway down the jetway). Once you are
past that ticket person, the only obstacle to actually getting your guitar
on the plane WITH YOU is a steward/ess ON the plane. They are usually not
interested in stopping you at that point. If they do, I simply (and
politely) say that "if we can't fit it in an overhead or other onboard
area, I will be happy to Gate Check it, since I already have the Gate Check
paperwork in place. But could we try, first?"

I have never failed to get a guitar on the plane with me using this method.

Larry Pattis

Lpattis "at" xmission "dot" com

Liberal Palette Records
http://liberalpalette.com
"Music Without Borders"


From: Larry Pattis <abuse@127...>
Subject: Re: Martin Guitar Cases - fit for air travel?
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 12:26:41 -0600
Organization: XMission http://www.xmission.com/

In article <<abuse-ya02408000R2409981224000001@news...>>,
<abuse@127...> (Larry Pattis) wrote:

> In article <<360A8628.F15CFC4E@Juno...>>, "George C. Kaschner"
> <<GeoKasch@Juno...>> wrote:
>
>
>
> >
> > I wonder how many times we'll say "Gate Check" before people start
> believing it.
> >
> > Go for the tone,
> >
> > George
>
>
> The best thing about Gate Check/Gate Claim is that if you brazenly disply
> your Gate Check claim tag attached to the handle of your guitar case as you
> are handing your ticket to the gate/jetway person during boarding, they
> will simply "assume" that you will be allowing the airline baggage person
> to grab your guitar (at that door midway down the jetway). Once you are
> past that ticket person, the only obstacle to actually getting your guitar
> on the plane WITH YOU is a steward/ess ON the plane. They are usually not
> interested in stopping you at that point. If they do, I simply (and
> politely) say that "if we can't fit it in an overhead or other onboard
> area, I will be happy to Gate Check it, since I already have the Gate Check
> paperwork in place. But could we try, first?"
>
> I have never failed to get a guitar on the plane with me using this method.
>
> Larry Pattis

I forgot to mention that I do this WITH a Calton Case wrapped around my
precious guitar, and I am always fully ready to follow through with giving
up my guitar! That way I don't have to drink myself silly during the
flight.

Larry Pattis

Lpattis "at" xmission "dot" com

Liberal Palette Records
http://liberalpalette.com
"Music Without Borders"


From: George C. Kaschner <GeoKasch@Juno...>
Subject: Re: Martin Guitar Cases - fit for air travel?
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 08:37:19 -0600
Organization: Los Alamos National Laboratory

<chrisc@blueridge...> wrote:

> 1. The problem is that you are NEVER guaranteed the ability or right to carry
> the guitar with you on board to your seat. If the case/guitar aren't too
> large, the odds are good that you can do so, but so many factors can prevent
> it. For example, I took a commuter jet recently from Asheville to
> Atlanta..and there was NO way the commuter jet was going to allow anything
> the size of a guitar carried to my seat...

I, too, have flown the puddle jumpers and field hoppers and although they don't
have room for the guitar to have a seat in first class, my guitar has always been
treated well. I just carry it as far as they'll let me and then ask them to stow
the guitar somewhere safe. Although I may have to wait a moment at the
destination, they always hand the guitar to me at the plane and let me carry it
back across the airstrip to the terminal. If you're in a hurry, don't expect the
best treatment. It's usually going to be one or the other.

> 2. I am Seriously thinking about a Calton case.

That's not a bad idea. My most recent guitar has one and I like it. On the other
hand, the guitars with all the miles are in the same ol' standard case that
Michael Gurian put them in some 20 years ago.

> 3. Until I can afford one/get one, I would get some 3/4 inch nylon strapping
> tape and strap around the neck and possibly the lower body of the case. Most
> of the damage I've seen with guitars has more to do with the latches giving...

Of the guitars that I've seen damaged in transit, it's usually because their cases
provided inadequate neck support, they were strung to pitch, and they took a hard
rap. Latches were intact and shut. As a result, those instruments needed
anything from neck resets (some including regluing the neck block), bridge
replacement, to neck/headstock splices.

> to prevent this I pack my extra socks and underwear or t shirts around the
> guitar in the case to get a tight fit....

Barney Kessel told me that he liked to pack his clothes in his guitar case and his
guitar in his flight case. When he got to the destination, he'd unload his
clothes into the dresser at his hotel and put his guitar into the ol' beatup case.

Go for the tone,

George

Checking a Calton Case when Flying [3]
From: Pkfish <pkfish@aol...>
Subject: Checking a Calton Case when Flying
Date: 24 Sep 1998 23:38:31 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Just another bit of anecdotal research here.

I often travel with several instruments, so carry-on is not an option for every
one of them. I've been checking my Martin in a Calton case every few weeks for
years now and never had any trouble with instrument damage due to mishandling.
This includes perhaps hundreds of flights--regional, cross-country and
international. The case itself has some surface scratches and has lost a few
metal bumbers, but it otherwise fine. I always pack the neck block and peghead
with extra pieces of foam or spare socks, loosen the strings, and duct-tape the
latches. I am generally more concerned with the instrument getting mis-routed
or lost or left out on the tarmac in extreme weather than I am about structural
damage. Also, I get very nervous whenever I have a connection in Denver,
because of the automated luggage handling, and do my best to avoid that
particular hub.

So far so good, although this approach requires a certain willingness to accept
fate.

By the way, Calton has had a policy of refurbishing its cases for the price of
2-way UPS shipping when the latches, bumpers and hinges get too trashed.

Paul Kotapish
notary sojac
<<pkfish@aol...>>


From: SStone8807 <sstone8807@aol...>
Subject: Re: Checking a Calton Case when Flying
Date: 25 Sep 1998 00:05:18 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

<pkfish@aol...> wrote:

>Also, I get very nervous whenever I have a connection in Denver,
>because of the automated luggage handling, and do my best to avoid that
>particular hub.

Hello,

The biggest problem with DIA is NOT the automated luggage handling.

The main problem here is the guitar theives. DIA has NO, NONE, NADA, security
at luggage pick-up. David Wilcox had his Olson lifted from the baggage area
about a year ago, I also have gotten e-mail from guitarists who've caught
slime-balls trying to make off with their guitars.

If you fly into Dever with a checked guitar RUN, DO NOT WALK to the luggage
claim area so you can get there before your instrument.

bye,

Steven Stone


From: Hojo2X <hojo2x@aol...>
Subject: Re: Checking a Calton Case when Flying
Date: 25 Sep 1998 01:28:25 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Paul Kotapish wrote about Calton cases:

>I am generally more concerned with the instrument getting mis-routed>or lost
or left out on the tarmac in extreme weather than I am about>structural>damage.

I can't comfort you about the mis-routing, but perhaps I can ease your mind
about the instrument being out on the tarmac during extreme weather. In my
experience, the Caltom has the best thermal protection of any case out there.

I live in Alaska, where the weather sometimes get a tad extreme. Only, say,
seven or eight months out of the year. I bought my first Calton case because I
had been chosen for the Alaska Artists In The Schools program, and it entails
going out to remote villages to serve residencies.

The way one GETS to these villages is to take an Alaska Airlines jet to a
regional hub like Dillingham or Bethel or Barrow, then you transfer to little
puddlejumper planes for the ride into the village. More than once I have
ridden in the co-pilot's seat in a plane that looked like it was being held
together by duct tape. ("Hundred Mile An Hour Tape" is what they call it up
here.)

Typically, the pilot buzzes the school, which is always the biggest building in
the village. Then he sets down on the airstrip. Most village airstrips have
no terminal or shelter of any kind, and they tend to be a few miles outside of
the village proper.

The pilot unloads you, your baggage and your instruments, bids you a cheery
farewell, then takes off and leaves you. Standing unprotected on the tundra.
With your instruments. In thirty five below farenheit temperatures. (For our
friends and cousins who use the Celsius scale, this translates to: "Colder than
you even want to think about.")

When you factor in the windchill factor from the Arctic winds, it is definitely
brass monkey weather. (Anyone who needs a translation of the phrase "brass
monkey weather" can e-mail me privately. I've already been chided this week
for some phallic humor on another thread...)

None of this would be so bad if someone was right there to greet you, but the
villages operate on Village Time, which means that when the plane buzzes the
school the janitor starts thinking about maybe donning his snowmobile suit, and
getting out there on the snow machine with the wooden sled and picking up you
and your stuff.

But he's not in any hurry.

So maybe half an hour or forty five minutes later of standing around stomping
your feet in 35 below temperatures, the janitor finally shows up to load you on
the back of the Sno-Go and your instruments in a rude plywood sled pulled
behind. Then he takes off at 45 miles an hour back to the village, and it's
Mr. Toad's Wild Ride, Arctic style.

The point I am getting to is that my Calton case protected my guitar admirably
every time I subjected it to this treatment, and I never had the slightest
problem with the instrument while on thefrozen tundra. So, should YOU be
concerned about the guitar in a Calton being stranded for a while on a baggage
cart on some Lower 48 runway?

No problem, dude!

Some other time, perhaps, I'll tell you how that same Calton case (and the
guitar inside) survived a glacial wave that whacked us and our campsite
opposite the Childs Glacier, but that's another story entirely.

Trust me. You've got a nice case there. You needn't worry about the
environment when you have a fine guitar latched inside, unless, perhaps, you
make a habit of spelunking inside active volcanoes.

Wade Hampton Miller

travel with guitar [2]
From: Adrian Legg <leggman@**dicron.co.uk>
Subject: Re: travel with guitar
Date: 2 Oct 1998 22:42:34 -0100
Organization: loose

In article <6v2jr8$1o1$<1@lark...>> Robert
Horn, <hornrn@jmu...> writes:
>Subject: travel with guitar
>From: Robert Horn, <hornrn@jmu...>
>Date: 2 Oct 1998 13:18:32 GMT
>>I plan to travel to Europe for about three months next year and want to
>bring my aocustic guitar with me. I have a hard case and a gig bag and
>would like to know the best way to bring the guitar on the plane.

++++snip++++

You should probably note the the Boeing 777 is
getting very popular on the Transatlantic runs.
It's a twin, so it's cheaper to run. Part of the
p.r. of getting over people's natural concern
about being over water for so long with a few
less engines was a complete cabin makeover. As a
result of which, coach overheads are 37.5 inches
long.
I measured one the first time I got the 'plane.
Closet space is also very much reduced, and it
seems, primarily for business class pax's
jackets.
I get a guitar on that is 36.5 inches long -
part of the spec was dictated by the 777.
If you have a soft case and can get it past
groundstaff to the plane, Miss may be
sympathetic; she may not. If she has a full
flight, you have a problem. If you are
travelling business class, you may get a more
sympathetic hearing than in coach.
If you get on the plane last and the overheads
are full, your problem is compounded.
Most guitars get shipped for sale in their cases
or in cardboard frames in cardboard boxes - I
saw hundreds arrive here in the UK with no
problem. Your safest bet is probably to do
similiarly, or invest in a Calton, and check
your guitar. Internal flights in Europe are even
less sympathetic about excessive cabin baggage
than in the US.
An occasional squint through rec.travel.airlines
will keep you abreast of the latest horrors on
Delta, for example.
Good luck......

http://www.roe.ac.uk/mjpwww/legghead.htm

E-mail may not be answered for months during
extended and computerless motel-hopping
frenzies.There are management addresses at the
web page.


From: Steve & Caren Comeau <notcomeau@erols...>
Subject: Re: travel with guitar
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1998 09:00:32 -0400

I got these recommendations (below) from the June 1996 issue of Acoustic
Guitar. The author had lots of experience (good and bad) traveling to gigs
on different airlines.

Good luck to you and your guitar on your trip.

All the best,

Steve Comeau, <notcomeau@erols...>
(delete the spam-avoidance word "not" from my address to reply)
---
*"Nothin' to tell now.
* Let the words be yours,
* I'm done with mine." - Barlow

Guitars and Airline Travel (my title)
From the June 1996 issue of Acoustic Guitar:
1) Check the guitar in at the gate (not at the check-in desk). In some
cases, if the flight isn't full, they'll let you carry it on. If you
have to check it request the pressurized cargo hold (where they put
folks pets) since it is climate controlled. The other holds can get
pretty cold.
2) Use a hardshell case! Baggage handlers are not kind and some take
sick pleasure in mishandling luggage. You may want to invest in
some of the better hard shell cases designed for traveling bands.
3) Pad the peghead. Broken pegheads are a common injury to guitars in
transit. Just the weight of the tuning gears can snap the peghead
if the guitar is dropped. T-shirts or socks packed tightly around the
peghead work well.
4) Loosen the tension on the strings before travel. This reduces the
stress on the top.
5) For more insurance, pack the guitar (in its case) in a box and stuff
your clothing in the spaces around the case for more cushioning. Use a
plain rectangular box and it will be less obvious to vicious baggage
handlers and thieves that it is a guitar. Be sure to label the box
with your name and address. Also, it would be a good idea to put a
"Fragile" sticker on it (I know, this probably tempts the baggage
handlers).
6) Pick up your guitar from baggage claim immediately! Don't let
someone steal it.
7) Give the instrument time to get back to room temperature before
tuning up and playing. Sudden changes in temperature can put checks,
and worse - cracks, in the body. Leave it in the case for awhile then
open the case and let it sit a little longer before playing it.
Other tips:
Use a gig bag if you're trying to carry it on. The type that strap on
like a back pack can make the guitar less obvious.
Don't push the airline. Don't bring a lot of carry on luggage - your
guitar and one small bag should be it. You'll get the best response
if you're friendly and positive, not indignant.
Board as early as possible. If you can afford it fly business or
first class. Frequent flyers get preferred status for boarding
above certain mileage levels. If you board late, all the overhead
storage may be taken.
Find out what type of aircraft you'll be on. The Boeing 700 series
(e.g. 737, 747, etc.), airbuses and DC-10 are usually fine. L10-11's
are too small. Also, airlines like Southwest Airlines and United
Shuttle (not the regular United flights) usually won't let you
board with your guitar.

Robert Horn wrote in message <6v2jr8$1o1$<1@lark...>>...
>I plan to travel to Europe for about three months next year and want to
>bring my aocustic guitar with me. I have a hard case and a gig bag and
>would like to know the best way to bring the guitar on the plane. Is a
>guitar in a hard case considered carry on luggage? I would hate to have
>to put my guitar in with checked baggage. What do people who travel
>with guitars usually do?
>

United Airlines New Rules [6]
From: Saul Rosenthal <saul@adldenver...>
Subject: United Airlines New Rules
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 11:09:36 -0700
Organization: Anti-Defamation League

This morning's Rocky Mountain News (Denver) has a story that United is
planning on installing templates on the x-ray machines at Denver
International Airport to screen luggage sizes. The template has a 9 by
14" opening. If your item does not fit through the opening you will be
required to check it through. They plan to have staff on site to check
bags (and gig bags, I assume).

I've written to United asking if they will make an exception for musical
instruments which cannot be safely checked.

I am also considering organizing a legal effort to block this new
proceedure and to force the airlines to allow carry on of instruments
which will fit in the overheads.

If you have any thoughts about what we an be doing, let me know.
Inevitably the United/Denver plan will spread to other airports and
airlines.

Saul R.

P.S. Now would be a good time, I think, to invest in Calton company
stock!


From: Adrian Legg <leggman@**dicron.co.uk>
Subject: Re: United Airlines New Rules
Date: 15 Oct 1998 21:06:36 -0100
Organization: loose

In article <<36263A60.39C7@adldenver...>> Saul
Rosenthal, <saul@adldenver...> writes:
>Subject: United Airlines New Rules
>From: Saul Rosenthal, <saul@adldenver...>
>Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 11:09:36 -0700
>>This morning's Rocky Mountain News (Denver) has a story that United is
>planning on installing templates on the x-ray machines at Denver
>International Airport to screen luggage sizes. The template has a 9 by
>14" opening. If your item does not fit through the opening you will be
>required to check it through.
+++++snip++++

Last I heard was UA were planning to limit cabin
baggage for customers on discount fares. Nobody
was quite sure how they would actually put this
into effect though, and so far I've seen no
evidence of it on international flights. I've
been skipping domestic as much as possible......
DIA is a mess in its own sweet way isn't it ?

http://www.roe.ac.uk/mjpwww/legghead.htm

E-mail may not be answered for months during
extended and computerless motel-hopping
frenzies.There are management addresses at the
web page.


From: <chaya@san...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines New Rules
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 23:24:59 GMT
Organization: Deja News - The Leader in Internet Discussion

I've seen the template in work when I was checking in a few weeks ago &
didn't have any problem -- keep in mind that it's a width/depth thing &
doesn't check length. So as long as you don't have a super wide instrument,
you can still pass the check.

In article <<36263A60.39C7@adldenver...>>,

  Saul Rosenthal <saul@adldenver.com> wrote:
> This morning's Rocky Mountain News (Denver) has a story that United is
> planning on installing templates on the x-ray machines at Denver
> International Airport to screen luggage sizes. The template has a 9 by
> 14" opening. If your item does not fit through the opening you will be
> required to check it through. They plan to have staff on site to check
> bags (and gig bags, I assume).
>
> I've written to United asking if they will make an exception for musical
> instruments which cannot be safely checked.
>
> I am also considering organizing a legal effort to block this new
> proceedure and to force the airlines to allow carry on of instruments
> which will fit in the overheads.
>
> If you have any thoughts about what we an be doing, let me know.
> Inevitably the United/Denver plan will spread to other airports and
> airlines.
>
> Saul R.
>
> P.S. Now would be a good time, I think, to invest in Calton company
> stock!
>

--
chaya

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own


From: E String 6 <estring6@aol...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines New Rules
Date: 16 Oct 1998 01:11:21 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Hi, I flew from NYto Oregon this past July,on Delta.They have an instrument
exception to their carry on rules.If I can remember correctly , it was
something like 48" x 18" x 8".My travel guitar was way smaller so I DIDN'T
dwell on the numbers too much, but check out Delta ,you may have to press the
travel agent to make the right call. Happy Trails,Andy


From: <garklavs@aol...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines New Rules
Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 02:47:50 GMT
Organization: Deja News - The Leader in Internet Discussion

I just flew from Minneapolis to DIA and back this week. There was
an "airport news" item on the overhead TV talking about United's
successful test of the luggage scan system that was tested in
New York airports, which will be implemented shortly on all domestic
flights. Flying back from DIA today, and sitting close to the
ticket desk, I heard the agent tell everyone with luggage that
looked even remotely large that "NEW RULES WILL SOON BE ENFORCED!"

I have no idea if there will be exceptions for guitars/instruments.
The United agent, frankly, worked with the efficiency and personality
of an automaton. NEXT PLEEZ!

George

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own


From: JFoxMusic <jfoxmusic@aol...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines New Rules
Date: 20 Oct 1998 18:40:19 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

>It seems that what some folks on this group like to do is "gate check"
>their guitar which means - carry it to the gate, and check it
>there. That way, so the theory goes, it gets hand carried to the
>luggage compartment of the plane bypassing much of the luggage-chewing
>machinery, and gets hand-carried back to the gate on arrival. last-on,
>first off, and you carry it to the gate, and pick it up at the gate.<<<<<

This theory sounds just fine, but it often fails. First, the instrument is
still in the baggage compartment and subject to abuse during the flight, from
turbulance, shifting baggage, etc.
Second, they often do not supply a person at the other end to retrieve your
instrument, so it goes right to the "carousel" and is damaged while flying
through the air from the plane to the truck, or from the truck to the ground,
or on the big slide down to the carousel.
I've seen it more often than not.
The only solution is to use a travel case, like an anvil trunk. I do it all the
time with success. It's not perfect, though. Even a trunk can be easily pierced
by a fork lift. It has happened to one of mine.
The cartage company I use usually has their own shipping conainer, which they
bind in plastic, so our stuff travels in its own nest. Sometimes.
One thing you can count on: Each trip is a new adventure of problems.

>>>BUT with the new United rules, if the guitar doesn't fit through
>the X-ray machine, how does one carry it to the gate for a gate check?<<<<

Open the case for a visual check. Shouldn't be a problem. Just another
inconvenience.

>>>Perhaps that's a better question to ask United since you probably
>won't get anywhere asking to carry full-sized cases onboard as a
>general policy. Anyone flying United in the near future want to ask?<<<

Truth is, nothing has changed, really. Trying to carry the instrument on board
is still a gamble. Always was. The baggabe people don't care about your guitar.
Never did.

If you really care about your guitar, drive to your destination, or better
still, stay home.

Jim Fox

United Airlines Called Today
From: George C. Kaschner <GeoKasch@Juno...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines Called Today
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 1998 11:33:15 -0600
Organization: Los Alamos National Laboratory

Saul Rosenthal wrote:

> Last June I received a letter from United Airlines regarding carryon
> luggage. It included the line, "even though your guitar is technically
> larger than our guidelines, we would hope that our flight attendants
> would excercise good judgment in allowing you to carry your delicate
> instrument onto the aircraft". I was pleasantly surprised.
>
> Then last week United announced plans to install a template in airports
> which will make it absolutely impossible to pass a guitar case (except
> the travel guitars) through. So I wrote to my pen pal at United and
> said, now what?
>
> Lo and behold, she called this morning to say that my letter had been
> "thoroughly discussed" at a staff meeting this morning. And the answer
> is, tough luck - you'll have to check your guitar. We debated the issue
> for 10 minutes and I even suggested that I might try to organize a
> lawsuit. She tried to argue that the FAA was really behind this but I
> wasn't buying that line.
>
> So, get your Calton, Anvil and Mark Leaf cases before the price jumps
> 25%. We're going to need them - unless, of course, any attorney
> musicians out there want to volunteer to organize the lawsuit and go for
> an injunction to prevent United (to be followed by the rest of the
> airlines) from doing this to us.
>
> Saul R.

So are you telling us that "gate checking" is not an option either?

George, The Flying Tone Gopher

Flying WIth Guitar? [5]
From: Mike Papciak <mike_papciak@my-dejanews...>
Subject: Re: Flying WIth Guitar?
Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 18:28:12 GMT
Organization: Deja.com - Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

  john.milman wrote:
> Do airlines let you take a guitar in a proper hard case in the plane
> with you when you fly?

Don't count on it. As these posts -- and numerous articles in music mags
and online -- indicate, airlines are getting more fascistic than ever in
terms of carry-on restrictions.

These plastic luggage-size templates at the X-ray machine are spreading;
I've heard from reliable sources that because of these size
guards at the X-ray machine, musicians have even been prevented from
carrying the guitar to the gate where it can be hand-loaded (called a
"gate check"), leaving conveyor-belt torture at the front counter the
only choice.

I was planning a trip to Europe (later cancelled for unrelated reason) a
year ago and did extensive research on overhead compartment dimensions,
etc. Important: just because your guitar and its case will actually
fit is moot; often, airlines simply won't let you on the plane. My wife
plays violin, and even with that small case, she has had to argue with
gate crews. Some of them seem to have a shark-smelling-blood reaction to
wood and strings!

I have fantasies about a guitar-playing airline exec deciding to be an
industry maverick and mandate sensible and reasonable policies with
regard to instrument carry-on. We'd all patronize them exclusively,
right? (Maybe someone's reading this!) However, I'm told it's a pipe
dream. Musicians, even as a group, mean squat to these companies.

On a slightly more optimistic note, here are a few tricks, and
recommendations, and suggestions culled from several different
perspectives:

-Don't travel with a guitar you're attached to.

-Do travel, but buy a Calton.

-Borrow a guitar from a friendly RMMGAer in the town you're going to.

-Investigate damage options with a real musical instrument insurance
company. Folkies like me don't usually bother with this stuff, but many
classical musicians have their instruments insured against handling
damage, theft, etc.

-Research online and in print. I recommend STRINGS Magazine in
particular. Those classical folks travel to festivals all the time, and
they frequently contribute stories and anecdotes on this topic. Note:
most of them seem to use fiberglass flight cases.

-Email friendly professional guitarists, who must fly, for their advice.

-Roll the dice: take your guitar in a gig bag. Tom Long and John
Renbourn have told me they've done this (though I don't know if they
still do, or always do). The gig bag is smaller, they can sneak in with
it slung over the shoulder and hang it in a coat closet. Problem is, if
the coat closets are full of mink stoles from first class and your
guitar's just got a fabric shell around it and they say it's gotta go in
the hold, you're dead.

-Argue or plead. Pat Kirtley told me (again, I'm not claiming he still
does this or does this every time) that he has on occasion looked the
gatekeeper in the eye and said, politely but seriously, "Ma'am, I make
my living with this instrument." There's an article on air travel at
Pat's website BTW.

-Buy an extra seat for your instrument. (Yeah, right!)

Options 1-3 are probably best. Bon voyage!

Mike Papciak

--== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==--
---Share what you know. Learn what you don't.---


From: Jas <jas@shocking...>
Subject: Re: Flying WIth Guitar?
Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 09:39:01 -0700

Mike Papciak wrote:

> -Argue or plead. Pat Kirtley told me (again, I'm not claiming he still
> does this or does this every time) that he has on occasion looked the
> gatekeeper in the eye and said, politely but seriously, "Ma'am, I make
> my living with this instrument." There's an article on air travel at
> Pat's website BTW.

Where's Pat's website?

I'm putting together a webpage with the airlines responses to guitar
travel as I gather the information. Do we want "official policy", or
horror stories, or both on this page? (I thought a little publicity
might loosen the screws a bit!)
--
Jas že O'Growney
http://www.shocking.com/~jas
--
When Life does not find a singer to sing her heart she produces a
philosopher to speak her mind. -Kahlil Gibran (1883-1931) [Sand and
Foam]


From: Georgethe4 <georgethe4@aol...>
Subject: Re: Flying WIth Guitar?
Date: 25 May 1999 23:57:17 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

   Thank You, Republic Airlines     (Tom Paxton)
Flying through the Michigan skies
with a song in my innocent heart
I placed myself in professional hands
masters of the traveller's art
when I opened my guitar case
at the end of a beautiful flight
I'm sure you can imagine my feelings
as I beheld this beautiful sight

Thank you Republic Airlines
for breaking the neck on my guitar
I arrived to do a concert with the Kingston Trio
opened my guitar case with a smile "con grio" (?????)
thank you Republic Airlines
what a joy to a musician you are
what a zest you've added to pedestrian skies
It was boring to be flying where the wild goose flies
But the tedium was broken by your wonderful surprise
when you broke the neck on my guitar

Thank you Republic Airlines
for treating my instrument with care
there can be no greater happiness for a musician
than to find his instrument in this condition
Uh-oh Republic Airlines
in the firmament of travel you're a star
for you treat each piece of baggage like a child of your own
when you come across an instrument it's dropped like a stone
may you waken every morning with a new broken bone
like you broke the neck on my guitar

Now I've been travelling most of my life
and the thrill is a long time gone
and the sight of another DC 10
just fails to turn me on
but I feel my heart start pounding
when I get to the baggage claim
and when I see how you handled my instrument
the thrill is still the same

Thank you Republic Airlines
for splintering the neck on my guitar
My guitar case was so strong that nothing could go through it
Way to go Republic only you could do it
crash bang Republic Airlines
in the field of demolition you'll go far
for you took it as a challenge when I turned in my case
and you saw the fragile stickers glued all over the place
may a team of mad flamingo dancers do to your face
what you did to the neck on my guitar

There could no satisfaction greater than if
you should be the next to go the way of Branniff

(At least he's not bitter. :-)
Cool, cool
George IV


From: Elizabeth A. Herreid <herreide@hotmail...>
Subject: Re: Flying WIth Guitar?
Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 02:09:43 GMT
Organization: Together Networks - Burlington, VT.

I'm coming on on this thread rather late, so this may or may not be
much use...

I recently flew from Frankfurt to Boston on Lufthansa. They flat out
told me there was no WAY I would be allowed to carry my guitar on
board. Same with gate checking. However, they did hand carry it out
for me, which was better than nothing. Of course, BOSTON doesn't
care. On that end I was expecting them to carry it out for me again
since it had stickers all over it saying fragile and hand carry only,
but they dumped it on the carousel with everything else. I had it in
a Calton case, so I was more worried about stealing than anything
else, but it still kind of bothered me. I'm just glad we both made it
OK!

Elizabeth


From: Bob Dorgan <d77737@epix...>
Subject: Re: Flying WIth Guitar?
Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 16:15:36 -0400
Organization: Dorgan Welding

Elizabeth A. Herreid wrote:
>
> I'm coming on on this thread rather late, so this may or may not be
> much use...
>
> I recently flew from Frankfurt to Boston on Lufthansa. They flat out
> told me there was no WAY I would be allowed to carry my guitar on
> board. Same with gate checking. However, they did hand carry it out
> for me, which was better than nothing. Of course, BOSTON doesn't
> care. On that end I was expecting them to carry it out for me again
> since it had stickers all over it saying fragile and hand carry only,
> but they dumped it on the carousel with everything else. I had it in
> a Calton case, so I was more worried about stealing than anything
> else, but it still kind of bothered me. I'm just glad we both made it
> OK!
>
> Elizabeth
You covered the biggest problem with flying with a guitar.
The abuse issue is easier to deal with than the theft.

 Calton cases will, for the most part, take the abuse the airline
baggage system hands out, but you better sprint to that carousel, 'cause
if that guitar makes one full turn on the carousel without you grabbing
it, chances are it won't make the second.
Bob Dorgan

Gate Check for Guitar [2]
From: Larry Pattis <abuse@127...>
Subject: Re: Gate Check for Guitar
Date: Tue, 08 Jun 1999 13:26:37 -0600
Organization: XMission http://www.xmission.com/

In article <<abuse-ya02408000R0806991153330001@news...>>,
<abuse@127...> (Larry Pattis) wrote:

> In article <<19990608130752.05999.00002076@ng-fx1...>>,
> <georgethe4@aol...> (Georgethe4) wrote:
>
> > I'm flying from Portland to LA. The three lines currently offering the
> cheapest
> > round trips are Alaska, Delta and United. All three claim to offer "gate
> check"
> > options which will allow me to drop off and pick up my instrument at
the gate,
> > as opposed to having it tumble down a conveyor belt. Anybody had any
> experience
> > gate checking with any of these airlines? I won't be bringing along my best
> > guitar, but even so I'd hate to have to say goodbye to an old friend.
> > Cool, cool
> > George IV
>
>
> Two potential problems with the Gate Check method these days:
>
> 1) If there is that damned plexiglass covering at the x-ray machine, the
> folks there will likely not let you get to the gate with your guitar.
> Solution: You have to find a ticket agent/manager for the airlines you are
> flying on, they will walk with you to the x-ray machine and have the
> plexiglass cover unlocked so your guitar can get x-rayed. I have
> personally had to deal with this, and it is not too painful.
>
> 2) Some folks have reported that their guitar was not waiting for them on
> the jetway after a flight, and that it went with the rest of the baggage
> when the plane landed. Bummer. I have not had this happen. If it ever
> does happen, I suppose the best you can do is complain to the airline after
> the fact. Solution: Calton Case.
>
> Larry Pattis
>

It has been further pointed out to me in private (thanks George!) that if
the baggage crew puts your case on the jetway, or up by the boarding area,
literally anyone can grab your case and make a dash for it, especially if
you are at the back of the plane. I try to get seats up front because of
this. Same would hold true for scenario #2 above. Solution to thievery:
none that I know of, other than getting the guitar on-board with you on the
plane. Not always possible, although (knock on wood) I have had continued
good luck in this regard.

Larry Pattis

Lpattis "at" xmission "dot" com

Liberal Palette Records
http://liberalpalette.com
"Music Without Borders"


From: Larry Pattis <abuse@127...>
Subject: Re: Gate Check for Guitar
Date: Tue, 08 Jun 1999 19:30:29 -0600
Organization: XMission http://www.xmission.com/

In article <7jk7sl$3c7$<1@nnrp1...>>, <troutnut23@my-deja...> wrote:

> We just went through all this nonsense with Delta Airlines and you will
> be lucky if the guitar gets stolen instead of broken. Delta will force
> you to sign a waiver that absolves them of any responsibility whatsoever
> for their baggage handlers trashing your instrument. If it gets stolen
> at least you get to argue with them about value...
>
> My best advice:
>
> Pack it very well (good directions at www.frets.com) and ship it UPS or
> some insurable method where people at least have some responsibility for
> their actions. Letting a baggage handler who has no liability whatsoever
> have his way with your guitar is not a great idea, imho.
>
> Delta sucks.
>
> Dennis V.
>

Well, I live in Salt Lake City, which is a Delta hub. I'm in no position
to even WANT to defend Delta, but I have never had any sort of problem like
being forced to sign waivers, etc. Delta may indeed "suck," but it sounds
like you had an unusually bad experience...and I realize that this doesn't
help, you still had a bad experience...yikes.

I have certainly been "asked" to sign waivers, but I have politely
declined. By the way, I have two separate "rider" insurance policies for
my gear, one "professional" with certain guitars and gear listed (that I
use at gigs and when traveling professionally), I think I pay around $0.65
per $100 of value, and the other is a less expensive ($0.48 or $0.43 per
hundred) non-professional coverage....BOTH cover traveling with a guitar on
a plane, so if "push came to shove," I would explain this to any airlines
person and refuse to sign any waiver. And if THEY lost or damaged the
guitar, I would then still hold them liable! But I would be covered,
regardless.

Shipping a guitar via any of the carriers is simply is not an option for me
when I am traveling. My opinion is that you go to an airport properly
prepared for your instrument to deal with the worst treatment possible
(i.e., with a Calton or Leaf case), and then treat everyone as nicely as
possible (remember, that doesn't mean I don't occasionally put my foot
down, I said as nicely as "possible"!). I also practice subterfuge
whenever necessary, that is, I NEVER go to the main ticket counter area for
check-in with my guitar visible (if you cannot go directly to the gate), as
this is usually where you get the "waiver" treatment (the only place I've
experienced it). When you are at the gate, march right up and ask for a
Gate Check tag like you've done it a million times. Then, when you are
boarding the plane, simply forget about the doing the Gate Check thing
(it's tagged, so the gate-keepers will let you walk right onto the jetway
to board) and walk on the plane with the guitar. It works for me almost
every time. And since I have a Calton case, if someone does challange me
to relinquish the guitar while boarding, I will simply say "fine, here, no
problem." At this point, as the plane is boarding, no one has enough time
to be dealing with waivers, in my experience.

My earlier advice about getting a guitar through a plexiglass x-ray still
holds, even though you're going to the main ticket counter to ask for help.
In this case I simply say (very nicely, and to someone that doesn't look
too fragged), "I am gate checking my guitar, and I need your assistance to
get it through the x-ray area." Whoever ends up helping you is generally
in such a rush to get back to their position out front, that they wisk you
right through...and also don't deal with any silly paperwork.

Larry Pattis

Lpattis "at" xmission "dot" com

Liberal Palette Records
http://liberalpalette.com
"Music Without Borders"

Insurance? (was Re: Gate Check for Guitar)
From: Larry Pattis <abuse@127...>
Subject: Insurance? (was Re: Gate Check for Guitar)
Date: Wed, 09 Jun 1999 07:27:48 -0600
Organization: XMission http://www.xmission.com/

In article <7jkq7i$93n$<1@nnrp1...>>, <troutnut23@my-deja...> wrote:

> Sounds like great advice Larry. Wish I'd known a little more before we
> tried it last time in Spokane, WA. We ended up leaving the guitar in
> Spokane rather than take a chance with the baggage guys even though the
> guitar was superbly packed and probably could have taken just about any
> amount of abuse.
>
> Sounds like you are a real pro at traveling with guitars. In our case,
> it was sign the waiver, or forget taking the guitar. We left the guitar.
> Had we known how to do the little end run and how to avoid the guy at
> the ticket counter, I think we might have made it. Had I obtained good
> insurance of my own, I probably would have even signed the waiver if I
> had to, and they could have fought it out with State Farm instead of me
> if they broke it.
>
> I will call my insurance man in the morning. I suppose that a great many
> of us should do this anyway even if we are not traveling with them. My
> wife and I gradually worked our way up to our Martins, and I never
> really thought about our regular homeowners insurance probably being
> inadequate without a rider. These which is probably pretty cheap as you
> have pointed out. Actually now that I think of it, at one time I had
> added a $10,000 rider to cover my computers over standard coverage.
> Since high end computers are now worth about $3.25, I can probably have
> them just change the rider from computers to guitars.
>
> Thanks for the most practical advice I have seen on this subject Larry!
>
> Dennis V.

Dennis,

You're certainly most welcome. And thanks for reading through a lot of
stuff, even though the experience left you righteously angry.

To get any gear insured your insurance agent/company will likely require an
"appraisal," something written from a guitar shop. Some shops like to
charge you for this, others will help for free. Make sure that the gear is
insured for full replacement cost, and I generally list "full retail."
This costs a bit more, and although I know I can get "x" amount of discount
should I need to replace a store bought guitar, I feel more secure listing
the highest price I might have to pay.

Any homeowners policy should have the ability for the same comapny to write
a rider, and non-professional coverage (no gigs or professional travel) is
in the 43 to 48 cents per hundred $ per year range. You'll sleep better at
night, even if you never leave your house with your guitar. Ever heard of
fire or theft? What about a rambunctious three year old? Did I ever tell
you guys the story of how when I was 5 years old I skewered a leather
chair, oh, 5,6,10,12 times with a real sword (from above the fireplace in
an upstairs bedroom) at my grandparent's? KIds do the darndest things.....

Mr. Murphy, care to add anything?

Larry Pattis

Lpattis "at" xmission "dot" com

Liberal Palette Records
http://liberalpalette.com
"Music Without Borders"

How to bring your guitar on a plane? [5]
From: No Busking <nobusking@erols...>
Subject: Re: How to bring your guitar on a plane?
Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 00:16:08 -0400

WARNING!!! RANT FROM A FREQUENT TRAVELLER APPROACHING!!!

Harold wrote:
<snip>
>Everybody
>knows that a normal sized guitar is too big to satisfy the size
>requirements for carry-on luggage and it really is inconsiderate of the
>other passengers to expect special treatment.

<advice about shipping a guitar via FedEx snipped>

I can't really agree with this. I have travelled with my children when they
were young and we were living overseas...we needed special treatment for
that, and the airlines provided it - they even sold the seats that the kids
occupied for a lower price (and on a few of the flights when they were VERY
young and traveling for free, I'm sure my fellow passengers would have much
preferred I was carrying a guitar!) Some people have special dietary needs
for which the airlines cater for free. I've seen lots of people carrying
fragile pottery or crystal home from their holidays - larger than could be
stowed under the seat - and met with smiles and help in delicately placing
them in the overhead lockers.

Guitars are a fairly unusual and special case for airline handling. It's
pretty rare to see more than two people checking in for a single flight
carrying guitars. Accomodating passengers for this requirement doesn't have
to be a big deal, and shouldn't require the purchase of an extra seat. On a
jumbo jet, there is plenty of room for stowing the instrument, what is
lacking is the willingness of the airline to accomodate their customers.
Several times, sympathetic flight attendants have put my case in the hanging
lockers...and I've noticed plenty of room available there, even on today's
packed flights.

I travel business class for long-haul international flights...funny, when
I'm in the club cabin there's never been an issue with "enough room" for
anything I've carried on board - including too many pieces of luggage. Yes,
I know that's the privilege of paying more for the ticket, but it
demonstrates that the airlines have a lack of willingness to deal with
carry-on guitars...not an inability to accomodate it.

Failing carry-on, it would be nice if they'd take a little extra effort to
allow a gate-check and pickup, avoiding the sinister baggage handlers.
Baggage handlers abuse luggage for sport...I often stare in amazement when
their antics are visible. The airlines have zero liability for damage to
the instrument unless you invest in an exorbitantly priced case. You can't
even insure the instrument for possible damage. I've recently seen several
people stuck in the "it won't go through the machine" catch at the airport,
despite assurances from the ticket desk that they could "gate check".
What's up with that?

I know it's a rant, but a guitar is a portable instrument on which United
Airlines in particular has declared war. I'm a "special customer" of
United, and can honestly get away with carrying on whatever I want as a
result...but I burn every time I see a college kid trying to make it home
with an instrument that probably cost him a few meals - and they
intentionally and unnecessarily make his journey hell. Unfortunately, I
live close to a United hub airport and don't have a lot of choice in
carriers...I avoid them when I can.

All it takes is a willingness to deal with customer requirements on a
personal basis. At the very least, they could allow for special handling by
prior arrangement for guitars and other fragile items. The roulette that
travelling musicians are required to play is outrageous.

It's really not too much to ask.

rant over.
--
Michael Pugh


From: Diana Tuszynski <tuszynski@globalserve...>
Subject: Re: How to bring your guitar on a plane?
Date: 21 Sep 1999 05:39:32 GMT
Organization: Benefits Edge

Here's my take on taking my guitar on a plane.

I happen to be a pilot with Canadian Airlines in Canada. I live near
Toronto, but am based in Vancouver ( Yes, I commute three time zones). I
have a good hard shell case for my gibson CL35, I put it in special
handling, tape up all the latches and off I go, let the case do it's job.
The guitar travels with me every time I cross the country.

Years ago I almost did in my Sigma. Dumb Dumb as in asleep at the
wheel!!!! I was loading up the trunk of my car. Put the case down, got
interrupted by somebody ( long fish story ). Got in my car and backed over
the case. On hearing the crunching right away, and in a flash and cold
sweat remembered that my guitar was back there.... got out and had to
unjam the case from under the muffler. Man did that case look bad!
Opened it up, and the guitar was still as good as new (well not really new,
I played that guitar for 16 years).

Moral of the story. It's got to be some serious abuse to go through the
case to the instrument inside ( not saying that it's not going to happen,
but your got to weigh the risk for the trouble your going to go though).

Don't worry mun'

see ya,

Harold Dickert
<dickert@globalserve...>


From: Al Carruth <alcarruth@aol...>
Subject: Re: How to bring your guitar on a plane?
Date: 21 Sep 1999 13:19:29 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Re: Diana's story:
The problem is not so much stuff getting through or mashing the case as it is
the shaking that goes on inside. If the instrument has any wiggle room at all
it will seismically self-destruct with the head going one way and the body
another. That's the real beauty of a Calton or other fitted case. Of course,
that strong shell doesn't hurt...

For those for whom $500 for a case is not justified, the main thing is emulate
the unshakability. One way would be to tape over the hole and then fill the
case with plastic peanuts all around the guitar. Make absolutely certain that
no part of the instrument can touch the shell of the case.

Another thing I would recommend is not to put the case in a cardboard box.
Even with 'fragile' stickers all over it the baggage apes will fling a box
around freely. They seem to have gotten the word about guitar cases, though.
Last year, when I went to the GAL convention I had one guitar in a Calton and
another well packed in a box marked 'fragile' and so forth. They handled the
case like it was fresh eggs; hand carrying it to and from the 'plane. The box
went through the normal routine. Guess which guitar got broken.....

Alan Carruth / Luthier


From: Alan Marshall <bromley@northworthy...>
Subject: Re: How to bring your guitar on a plane?
Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 17:24:20 GMT

Don't forget about the low humidity problem on aircraft. I suggest you
put a humidifier in the case and then seal it around with plastic tape
around all the seams. A freind who is a pilot, told me that at 30,000
feet, the hold goes down to 0% humidity and around -30c (-20 f). There
are no heaters or air con in the hold on the majority of long haul
jets. If anyone knows differently, and on good authority, then I would
be interested to know.

Best Wishes, --
Alan Marshall
web page www.northworthy.com
e-mail <info@northworthy...>


From: Adrian Legg <Commercial-free@speech...>
Subject: Re: How to bring your guitar on a plane?
Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 11:24:20 +0000
Organization: *

Paul Cho <<paulcho@home...>> wrote:

> Thanks for all the info...
>
> Just curious, has anybody actually had their guitar damaged by airlines?

Yes. You may care to review previous threads in the deja news archive.

This n.g. around Dec 98/Jan this year, thread titled
air travel with guitar,Any tips

Same period in rec.travel.air , threads titled;
Carry-on size limit
and:
Carryons:Stats(is it worth it?)
Therein will you find much bitching, whining,righteousness, some
tragedy, and a very few measurements - enjoy :-)

--
Contact info: www.adrianlegg.com
or http://www.roe.ac.uk/mjpwww/legghead.htm

baby taylor as carry-on? [2]
From: DADGAD Tune <gsprigg@aol...>
Subject: Re: baby taylor as carry-on?
Date: 04 Nov 1999 13:21:23 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

I have taken a Baby Taylor with me on several international flights with no
problems at all as a carry-on. Flight attendants have at times doubted it
would fit in overheads, and the were surprise how easily it did.

Had no trouble on international flights using the following airlines:
British Air
Delta
Swiss Air
Austrian Air
Emirates Air

Larry


From: David Kilpatrick <david@maxwellplace...>
Subject: Re: baby taylor as carry-on?
Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:35:09 +0000
Organization: Icon Publications Ltd

When I bought my Lowden O-10 s/h from a US vendor, I flew by Icelandair
Glasgow to Baltimore and back. I really doubted they would let this
enormous (jumbo plus) bodied guitar in Hisocks case on the plane except
in the hold. I stuffed beanie babies all round the headstock and in the
spaces round the body, and sealed and wrapped the entire case with duck
tape. I then gave the rest of my tape to a family with baby strollers
who had to tape these up at the airline's request. I put a baggage tag
on it, and asked if I could hand check it into the hold and hand collect
it at the gate. They said 'just keep it with you'. When we boarded, they
called us early, and insisted the guitar went into the cabin and into
the overhead. It fitted with stacks of room all round. Maybe Icelandair
have huge overheads, but I was astounded and extremely pleased. There
was no way they would let it go in the hold, and we got preferential
treatment because I was carrying it.

I understand this is unusual and I may never again travel with a guitar,
but it's worth mentioning.

David Kilpatrick

DADGAD Tune wrote:
>
> I have taken a Baby Taylor with me on several international flights with no
> problems at all as a carry-on. Flight attendants have at times doubted it
> would fit in overheads, and the were surprise how easily it did.
>
> Had no trouble on international flights using the following airlines:
> British Air
> Delta
> Swiss Air
> Austrian Air
> Emirates Air
>
> Larry

airborne acoustics [4]
From: Ken Ewing <kene@sequent...>
Subject: Re: airborne acoustics
Date: 10 Jan 2000 21:37:38 GMT
Organization: Sequent Computer Systems, Inc.

In article <85dbft$ad4$<1@scotty...>>,
john slevin <<johnslevin@oceanfree...>> wrote:
>I am hoping to bring an expensive guitar (in it's case) across the atlantic
>in a few months time. All my previous attemps at getting guitars on as
>hand - luggage have been successful , avoiding the worry of getting back a
>caseful of woodpulp from the cargo hold at the arrival hall. However, I feel
>my luck may not last , and if I am forced to check in the guitar (a well
>respected make from Austin, Tx.) in the cargo-hold, what is the best course
>of action to take in order to minimise the risks? Any advice is welcome. By
>the way, the very frontmost overhead bin on an Airbus A300 aircraft
>adequately takes a dreadnaught-sized flightcase.

It depends on what airline you're using. Since you are flying in an
Airbus, there's a good chance this is a European airline. I flew across
the Atlantic in 1996 with my guitar. I was on Lufthansa. They absolutely
would not allow a guitar as a carry-on. The storage compartments in the
cabin certainly were not large enough to store a guitar (unlike the
compartments on domestic airlines).

My guitar just had a good-quality "normal" case. I had used it as something
of a second suitcase by packing T-shirts, socks, etc. into the empty spaces
around the guitar. To make things worse, the guitar was mistakenly put on
the wrong plane and traversed the Atlantic by a different route. It did
finally come through just fine.

Advice to cover the worst scenario? Here are a few tips:

 o  Get a travel case if possible (expensive).  
 o  Insure the guitar.  
 o  Pack clothing around the guitar in the case.  
 o  Perhaps detune the strings.  
 o  Lock the case.  (A friend of mine wraps duct tape around the case.)  
Check the following web page for lots of good info:

http://www.win.net/~mainstring/carryon.html

  Ken Ewing 
  IBM, NUMA-Q Brand (formerly, Sequent Computer Systems) 
  Beaverton, Oregon 
  kene@sequent.com 
  ...!uunet!sequent!kene 
----------------------------------------------------------------------


From: Tony Weber <Mycroft@alaska...>
Subject: Re: airborne acoustics
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:09:05 -0900
Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com

Also consider getting a shipping box from a music store, they often have them,
and will usually save you one f you go in and ask. Put the guitar, in it's case,
inside and pack clothes around it. Might cost you an oversize charge, but so
what, compared to replacement cost? a friend of mine did that, and stiffened the
box with a frame of 1"x1s" (not sure what that is in metric.)

Tony

Ken Ewing wrote:

> In article <85dbft$ad4$<1@scotty...>>,
> john slevin <<johnslevin@oceanfree...>> wrote:
> >I am hoping to bring an expensive guitar (in it's case) across the atlantic
> >in a few months time. All my previous attemps at getting guitars on as
> >hand - luggage have been successful , avoiding the worry of getting back a
> >caseful of woodpulp from the cargo hold at the arrival hall. However, I feel
> >my luck may not last , and if I am forced to check in the guitar (a well
> >respected make from Austin, Tx.) in the cargo-hold, what is the best course
> >of action to take in order to minimise the risks? Any advice is welcome. By
> >the way, the very frontmost overhead bin on an Airbus A300 aircraft
> >adequately takes a dreadnaught-sized flightcase.
>
> It depends on what airline you're using. Since you are flying in an
> Airbus, there's a good chance this is a European airline. I flew across
> the Atlantic in 1996 with my guitar. I was on Lufthansa. They absolutely
> would not allow a guitar as a carry-on. The storage compartments in the
> cabin certainly were not large enough to store a guitar (unlike the
> compartments on domestic airlines).
>
> My guitar just had a good-quality "normal" case. I had used it as something
> of a second suitcase by packing T-shirts, socks, etc. into the empty spaces
> around the guitar. To make things worse, the guitar was mistakenly put on
> the wrong plane and traversed the Atlantic by a different route. It did
> finally come through just fine.
>
> Advice to cover the worst scenario? Here are a few tips:
>
> o Get a travel case if possible (expensive).
> o Insure the guitar.
> o Pack clothing around the guitar in the case.
> o Perhaps detune the strings.
> o Lock the case. (A friend of mine wraps duct tape around the case.)
>
> Check the following web page for lots of good info:
>
> http://www.win.net/~mainstring/carryon.html
>
> Ken Ewing
> IBM, NUMA-Q Brand (formerly, Sequent Computer Systems)
> Beaverton, Oregon
> <kene@sequent...>
> ...!uunet!sequent!kene
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------


From: Chris Stern <cwstern@mediaone...>
Subject: Re: airborne acoustics
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:03:14 -0500

I have crossed the pond more times than I can remember and have never
carried a guitar on board yet. Sometimes I hand it over at the plane
door but usually I stick plenty of fragile stickers on it (or rather the
case!) and hand it over at checkin. I do not slacken off the strings
unless specifically asked to by the airline staff. I make sure nothing
can move about in the case.

I take the view that as long as the guitar is insured I can always buy
another and that walking around guitar shops with several thousand
$$$$$$ to spend would not be too awful. I am lucky not to be much of a
sentimentalist I suppose.

I don't however take my most expensive guitars on a plane or at least
have not yet. If I do it will be after purchasing a Calton case. Several
Taylors and Martin's have survived (by the grace of......) thus far.

I now have my HD28 permanently on the other side for use when I get
there.

Chris


From: Tor Arntsen <tor@spacetec...>
Subject: Re: airborne acoustics
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 10:33:27 GMT
Organization: Telenor Online Public Access

A colleague has brought a guitar several times (although not across the
atlantic), this was however an electric which has a much smaller case than
an acoustic. He actually asked our travel agent (NB: business flights) if
he could bring the guitar on board, they checked with the airline and said
"ok" every time. It was even printed on the ticket! I'm definitely going
to try the "asking first" route myself on my next flight.

About acoustic guitar cases though.. the flight attendendant on this
group (Stonker7 if I'm not mistaken) has said in earlier posts that
a gigbag is the way to go if you want to bring an acoustic on board.

-Tor

Guitar on flight - can you carry it on? [3]
From: Jim Wolcott <jwolc@accesscom...>
Subject: Re: Guitar on flight - can you carry it on?
Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 18:15:49 -0800

Greg and the Group -

I fly Southwest Airlines frequently, and usually with a guitar. I
always carry it on with me.

I learned this whilst talking to a flight attendent: Southwest policy is
to say "No" -- but if a passenger insists on carrying a guitar, they
figure there is a good reason. In this case, policy is not to refuse
a passenger who shows up at the gate with a guitar. This same attendent
told me that carrying a guitar would also qualify a passenger for
"Pre-boarding." Interesting, eh?

Realize that guitars are (relatively) big, for the overhead bins, so the
trick is to get on early.

What I do is try to get a low boarding pass number (in the first 30).
So be there early.

Next, when they call "Pre-boarding" (for kids and handicapped and etc.),
I try to walk right on with the guitar with the pre-board group. This
works about 20% of the time. (Daily reading of rmmga is some kind of
handicap, I think).

The other 80%, they make me wait. Then, with general boarding, I'm
right there at the front of the line, and waltz down the ramp to throw
the guitar in the first empty overhead bin that I see.

I've used this technique at least 10 times since last summer, at San
Jose, Oakland, Los Angeles, Orange County and Reno airports. At Los
Angeles, they had to remove the plastic template from their X-Ray
machine (it CAN be removed... it is just assembled to appear as though
it cannot).

As you might imagine, attitude is everything. If you sheepishly ask
if you can carry it on, you may well be refused. I've only been
questioned once (at Los Angeles), and I gestured to the guitar with a
concerned look: "Hey, it goes wherever I go."

Final thought: If you pull this stunt and are finally refused to carry
it on, this will happen at the ramp into the plane. In this case, the
guitar will be carefully placed in the cargo hold, rather than going
through conveyor-belt ramps. ALSO... at the gate, they won't force you
to sign that "Release of Liability" form that they have at Baggage
Check.

-Jim Wolcott
remove the "spamnot" to reply

Greg Z wrote:
>
> I just flew Southwest Airlines this past weekend, and I asked on the
> phone a day prior to departure. I asked specifically about a TRAVEL
> GUITAR, being my son's Yamaha FG-Jr. and got a no for carry on. It was
> the length which they said prevented it, since I had told them it would
> fit through the template. Of course, we dubbed this "Cattle Call"
> Airlines, so I don't know how others would be.
> There are many old threads to search for regarding this, but the
> rules are constantly changing. Anybody else have recent experience with
> this?
> I have an SKB 18 case, and I'm looking for a $100-$150 TPOS, which
> will be sufficient for these occasional needs.
> Also, they would not even consider hand checking my brother's drum
> (bagpipe band), it was a regular checked piece of baggage, and it is not
> the large bass drum, but the smaller (snare?) type.
>
> Greg Z
>
> In article <tg%u4.6775$<Jh3.825594@news3...>>,
> "M_Hartman" <<mhartman@arches...>> wrote:
> > I'm taking a trip this weekend and I would love to take my guitar, but
> I'm
> > kind of concerned about checking it. Do they let you carry guitars on
> the
> > plane? The plane is a DC-9 and the guitar is an acoustic in a
> hard-shell.
> > Any response would be appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mike Hartman
> >
> >
>
> --
> "There's bread to win and tolls to pay on Life's Highway"...Steve
> Wariner
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.


From: TupaMJ <tupamj@aol...>
Subject: Re: Guitar on flight - can you carry it on?
Date: 02 Mar 2000 01:12:12 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Flew USAir from Denver to Pittsburg last year and had no problem carrying my
guitar onto the plain, stowing it in the upper compartment, etc. Carried on my
Guild in a gig bag (the hard case wouldn't fit thru the xray machine).
Suggest you check onto the plane early (with the kids and old folks), place
your guitar up there and pack pillows, etc around the neck to protect it from
those monster wheeled carry ons. Good Luck


From: Jeff Lee <shipbrk@gate...>
Subject: Re: Guitar on flight - can you carry it on?
Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 04:28:37 GMT
Organization: a.r.s. Central Committee

<semcm@aol...> (SEMcM) wrote:
>
> When you do check your guitar do you worry about pressure/temperature/humidity
> in the cargo hold? Also, when I fly at least one leg of the flight is usually
> in a commuter plane, which means that even carry-on bags have to be placed in
> the hold. Any thoughts on that?

The bridge of one of my lutes came off once in transit (probably due to
temperature/humidity changes, according to the guy who fixed it).

Ever since then, I always loosen my strings before I travel, even on my
guitars. It's probably hard on the strings, but it's better than the
alternative.

--
Jeff Lee <shipbrk@gate...> http://www.gate.net/~shipbrk/

  "The only thing that helps me maintain my slender grip on reality
  is the friendship I share with my collection of singing potatoes."
Flying with an Olson [2]
From: Chris Stern <cwstern@mediaone...>
Subject: Flying with an Olson
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 18:36:21 GMT

I just got back from 3 weeks in Seattle, BC and Alberta.

Amazingly when I checked in at JAX for my US Airways flight I was asked by
the check in person if I would like to take my guitar as carry on baggage!

The first time I have ever been asked before my own request was made (and
invariably turned down), and he suggested a seat towards the back of the
plane so that I would be called early while there were still empty overhead
lockers!

On the plane(s) they were very helpful too.

Did the same on the way back too.

Worth travelling with again!

Chris Stern


From: Steve <scon@nospam...>
Subject: Re: Flying with an Olson
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 19:09:16 GMT
Organization: Time Warner Cable of San Diego, CA

I've flown Alaska Airlines many times with a guitar and, though I wasn't
always allowed to carry the instrument on board, I was always allowed to
"gate check" the instrument at the boarding gate. The guitar was always
waiting for me just outside the aircraft door as I stepped off the plane at
my destination. I've never been too uncomfortable with this arrangement.
It really depends on how full the flight is whether one will be allowed to
carry the instrument on board.
Northwest Airlines in my experience, has a strict policy that all baggage
that cannot fit through the retrofitted door on their x-ray machines when
entering their terminal must be checked as baggage at the ticket counter or
with a sky cap. When I inquired about baggage insurance it was very
expensive. I do not recall the amount, but I do recall that it was
exorbitant and cost prohibitive.
Steve C

Chris Stern <<cwstern@mediaone...>> wrote in message
news:FwEQ4.18689$<BG3.48644@typhoon...>...
> I just got back from 3 weeks in Seattle, BC and Alberta.
>
> Amazingly when I checked in at JAX for my US Airways flight I was asked by
> the check in person if I would like to take my guitar as carry on baggage!
>
> The first time I have ever been asked before my own request was made (and
> invariably turned down), and he suggested a seat towards the back of the
> plane so that I would be called early while there were still empty
overhead
> lockers!
>
> On the plane(s) they were very helpful too.
>
> Did the same on the way back too.
>
> Worth travelling with again!
>
> Chris Stern
>
>

Air travel with two guitars [2]
From: Elizabeth Papapetrou <NOSPAMmother@fdt...>
Subject: Air travel with two guitars
Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 04:46:44 GMT
Organization: University of Florida

Hey Guys.

I just got back from a week of playing in Connecticut and other parts of New
England. I took my Goodall GC and Santa Cruz H with me feeling a bit of
trepidation. I only have the original hard cases for both guitars and knew I
could never convince the flight attendents to let me put both in overhead
bins, and one of my flights was in a small jet without bins anyway. I
decided to try Continental Airlines special handling gate checking instead.
So ...I picked the brains of a few bowls of Larrys and endesd up packing a
whole bunch of my smaller items of clothing around each guitar and slackened
the strings to about half tension. Then I gaffer's taped all the catches of
each case and set off for Jacksonville Airport. I decided to just take a
single, wheeled carry-on case and, after experimenting for while, found I
could use a couple of bungee straps intended for mountain bike racks to hold
one guitar on the back of the case. In addition, I bought a heavy-guage
rifle shoulder strap and a couple of standard camping-type straps, fitted
the wholel shebang to the other guitar case and - voila ..I was able to
easily pull the guitar/carry-on case combo with my left hand and sling the
smaller guitar case (SCGC H) over my shoulder.

My outward journey started in Jacksonville and included changing planes at
Cleveland in order to get to Hartford CT. I really had no trouble with gate
checking at all and my system even allowed me to open the H case, retune the
strings and amuse myself (and a bunch of passengers in a 20 foot radius)
waiting out the 2 hours between flights. On arrival in Hartford, there was
one brief moment of panic when the flight crew told me that the gate folks
in Cleveland had set me up with the wrong labels and my guitars were about
to head off for the dreaded baggage handling system. However, it only took a
moment's attention from the 2 attendents to run down the stairs next to the
jet way and pick up both guitars for me, anyway.

In CT, I found I was smart tot bring along a couple of sets of strings as I
popped a couple while retuning the guitars ...but I was intending to change
them out, anyway. Both guitars were in perfect shape and performed
wonderfully for me.

On the return trip, this morning, I travelled on a 3/4 empty 737 from
Hartford to Newark NJ but the attendents wouldn't let me put my guitars in
the overhead bins, anyway. There was no problem with the gate check,
'though. However, my "system" got a severe test in Newark as I had to walk
more than half a mile between gates pulling the case/guitar combo and
carrying the other instrument, along with a purse over my shoulder and a
large grocery bag full of goodies. I needn't have worried - it was fine.
Then the NJ to JAX crew let me bin both guitars in the half empty plane and
I also had the extra luxury of a row of seats to myself ..so I could sleep!

All in all, I recommend gate checking IF:

1. You contact with the airline concerning their gate checking policies and
tell them what your needs are,very clearly. One time, the Continental gate
check lady insisted I sign a form releasing the airline from any liability
for damage to my instruments.
2. Pack each guitar very carefully and make sure all guitar cases are
hard-sided and in a fit condition to carry your instruments
3 Detune the strings down to about half tension.
3. Seal the case catches with removable Gaffers tape. You can use Duct tape,
if you want, but you'll be living with the scuzzy residue that stuff leaves
behind on your guitar cases for years.
4. Figure out an appropriate way to hand-transport all your stuff between
gates. Not thinking it out in advance is an invitation to disaster if you're
left with some unworkable transportation problem with no airline luggage
buggies around.
5. BE EXTRA POLITE TO THE AIRLINE STAFF. They want to help - make it easy
for them. If you get into an ornery match with airline staff you will likely
lose and find yourself checking your guitars for the carousel.
6. Try to get on the airplane early (you qualify for special reqjuirements
with 2 guitars, anyway) and, if you manage to get permission to overhead bin
the guitars, be prepared to leave the plane dead last on arrival otherwse
you will hold everyone behind you up for ages

OK? Any comments?

Regards

Elizabeth

--

                           Remove NOSPAM from email address for personal
       replies

From: Bob Dorgan <d77737@epix...>
Subject: Re: Air travel with two guitars
Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 11:56:29 GMT
Organization: Free Wades

Elizabeth Papapetrou wrote:
>
> Hey Guys.
snipped
>
> OK? Any comments?
>
> Regards
>
> Elizabeth

Glad to see it worked out for you.
I had one problem on American that you might find interesting.
I had also requested the gate check policy and procedures before leaving
for the UK.
Knowing that we had a changeover in JFK, I was a little worried I might
have some difficulty there.
I arrived at Rochester NY airport, unloaded our luggage and my wife
waited with the bags while I packed the car. A skycap helped her moved
everything to the American check in line. When I walked in the door, I
saw them picking up my guitar and placing it on the conveyor belt, even
though my wife was protesting. I sprinted across the terminal (as close
as I come to a spint these days), and stopped it just before it went
down the chute!
After explaining I intended to gate check it, they apologized profusely.
The clerk was very courteous. As we waited for the rest of the luggage
to get tagged and processed, I looked away, glancing at the crowd, and
when I looked back the guitar was on the damn conveyor again, and this
time it was too far gone to stop it.
I didn't see it again until we arrived in the UK.
Luckily it was in a Calton, so there was no damage, but I'd hate to
think what might have happened if I had intended to travel in a standard
hard shell case.
Glad to hear your travels went well.
Bob Dorgan

what is "gatechecking"? [3]
From: john slevin <jslevin@eircom...>
Subject: what is "gatechecking"?
Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 18:49:10 +0100
Organization: Eircom.Net http://www.eircom.net

I have a friend bringing my new guitar from JFK to Ireland next week.
I have given him the following instructions re. getting the guitar on board
with him:
A : Check in early.
B : Veeeery nicely ask the checkin person If he may carry on the guitar as
hand luggage:
C : Explain that the guitar is valuable, fragile and loved.
D: Grovel, beg, cry, bribe or whatever....

If all of this fails, and the guitar has to go in the hold, I have seen the
expression " gate-check" being used.
This would appear to be the last course of action. Could someone explain
what exactly a gate check means?
Does it make the guitar less prone to grief from baggagehandlers?
Thanks in anticipation.
John Slevin.


From: Steve <scon@nospam...>
Subject: Re: what is "gatechecking"?
Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 18:15:40 GMT
Organization: Time Warner Cable of San Diego, CA

To "gate check" a piece of luggage, i.e. guitar, means to proceed with the
instrument to the check-in gate in the terminal, the area where you wait to
board the aircraft. As you are boarding the aircraft, hand carry the guitar
to the ticket taker and tell them you have baggage to check in. They will
make out a baggage claim check before you board the aircraft. As you are
boarding the aircraft you leave the baggage at the entrance to the aircraft.
A flight attendant or baggage worker will hand carry the baggage to the
cargo hold. Upon arrival at your destination the baggage will be taken from
the hold and placed at the door of the aircraft or given to you directly as
you exit the aircraft.
There are airlines that will not allow you to gate check baggage though.
One that I know of through experience is Northwest Airlines. They insist
that any baggage entering the terminal must fit through a slot retrofitted
on their x-ray machines. I had the unpleasant experience of calling ahead
to confirm that I could gate check baggage and was told that I could. Upon
arrival I learned that I could not gate check my instrument. When I
inquired about insurance for the instrument, (an old Martin) I was told that
insurance was $5.00 per $100.00 in value. I took my chances and everything
turned out o.k. fortunately.
Alaska Airlines has always allowed me to either carry an instrument on board
or gate check it.
Call ahead and ask about the airline policy and ask specific questions
concerning the size of luggage that can be hand carried to the gate.
Good luck,
Steve C

"john slevin" <<jslevin@eircom...>> wrote in message
news:xe745.925$<r4.698@news...>...
> I have a friend bringing my new guitar from JFK to Ireland next week.
> I have given him the following instructions re. getting the guitar on
board
> with him:
> A : Check in early.
> B : Veeeery nicely ask the checkin person If he may carry on the guitar as
> hand luggage:
> C : Explain that the guitar is valuable, fragile and loved.
> D: Grovel, beg, cry, bribe or whatever....
>
> If all of this fails, and the guitar has to go in the hold, I have seen
the
> expression " gate-check" being used.
> This would appear to be the last course of action. Could someone explain
> what exactly a gate check means?
> Does it make the guitar less prone to grief from baggagehandlers?
> Thanks in anticipation.
> John Slevin.
>
>


From: Bob Dorgan <d77737@epix...>
Subject: Re: what is "gatechecking"?
Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 18:20:54 GMT
Organization: Free Wades

john slevin wrote:
>
> I have a friend bringing my new guitar from JFK to Ireland next week.
> I have given him the following instructions re. getting the guitar on board
> with him:
> A : Check in early.
> B : Veeeery nicely ask the checkin person If he may carry on the guitar as
> hand luggage:
> C : Explain that the guitar is valuable, fragile and loved.
> D: Grovel, beg, cry, bribe or whatever....
>
> If all of this fails, and the guitar has to go in the hold, I have seen the
> expression " gate-check" being used.
> This would appear to be the last course of action. Could someone explain
> what exactly a gate check means?
> Does it make the guitar less prone to grief from baggagehandlers?
> Thanks in anticipation.
> John Slevin.

Hi John,
Gate checking means that instead of going through the airport baggage
handling mechanism, the guitar is "checked' literally at the gate and
hand carried into the hold.

From what I was able to glean from my research, carrying on a full size
guitar, on an international flight will be very unlikely. Those planes
are at, or near capacity, and the attendants will be forced to disallow
it.
Good luck,
Bob Dorgan

Guitar and American Airlines - Good experience
From: Don Williams <dlwillms@removethis...>
Subject: Guitar and American Airlines - Good experience
Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2000 07:05:19 -0400
Organization: WebUseNet Corp http://www.usenetserver.com - Home of the fastest NNTP servers on the Net.

Hello fellow RMMGA'rs. Just returned from traveling to Nicaragua with
my MIGHTY FRAMUS. Atlanta to Miama to Managua and back again. I had
no problem whatsoever on any leg. I always politely asked if I could
stow it in the "closet", and on one occasion was even directed to put
it there before I even asked. I had bought a padded gig bag for the
trip, and it did fine. The humidity in country played havoc with the
strings and the finish was feeling pretty sticky before I left, but
all in all was a very successful trip! First time that I had flown
with a guitar, and was feeling some trepidation.

Regards,

Don

Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar? [7]
From: BrianMcCar <brianmccar@aol...>
Subject: Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar?
Date: 10 Aug 2000 02:45:04 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Any experiences with guitars on Southwest Airlines?

If you were going to Chattanooga with a guitar, would you take Southwest to
Nashville, or some other airline to Atlanta? I'm planning on renting a car and
driving the rest of the way from either airport.

Since there are no direct flights from here to Chattanooga, flying right there
would involve changing planes, which would at least double the handling risks,
and I'd need to rent a car anyway.

Is it total fantasy to think that the Nashville airport would be more
guitar-friendly than the average place?

Any stores in Nashville with a good selection of classical guitars?

Brian McCarthy


From: Marc Durso <dir1ssdc@earthlink...>
Subject: Re: Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar?
Date: Wed, 09 Aug 2000 20:19:54 -0700
Organization: http://www.remarq.com: The World's Usenet/Discussions Start Here

I am a member of the RMMGA and the owner of two fine hand made
guitars, Goodall and Thompson, because of Southwest Airlines.
They crushed, destroyed, my Guild D40NT on my flight into
Orlando from LA. The hardshell case looked like an elephant had
stepped on it.

That's a h**l of a way to be introduced to the world of hand
made guitars.

Marc Durso

Goodall/Thompson: http://communities.msn.com/Handmadeguitars
Society of Stage Directors & Choreographers Associate
Actors' Equity Association

-----------------------------------------------------------

Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
Up to 100 minutes free!
http://www.keen.com


From: Edison Ed <edisoned@aol...>
Subject: Re: Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar?
Date: 11 Aug 2000 15:01:05 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

I work with guitarist Mimi Fox and Mimi has been flying Southwest quite a bit.
She travels with her Heritage archtop and they always let her bring it on the
plane with her. Its the only airline so far, that hasn't given her a hassel
about it.
E.D.


From: Unsung96 <unsung96@aol...>
Subject: Re: Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar?
Date: 11 Aug 2000 15:03:30 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

<< I work with guitarist Mimi Fox and Mimi has been flying Southwest quite a
bit.
She travels with her Heritage archtop and they always let her bring it on the
plane with her. Its the only airline so far, that hasn't given her a hassel
about it.
E.D.

 >>
Fly out of Nashville alot on SW with guitar on board and fellow band mate with
j200 in case onboard. no problem yet.


From: Greg Z <gzinkmanNOgzSPAM@yahoo...>
Subject: Re: Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar?
Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 06:59:03 -0700
Organization: http://www.remarq.com: The World's Usenet/Discussions Start Here

I flew Southwest from Providence to Baltimore for EC3. They
actually TOLD me to carry it on. So I didn't even ask on the
return trip, no problems. If you are forced to check it, demand
to buy insurance on the spot. They may then send you on, cause
that will be a delay. (Just a thought that I would try)

Greg Z
"Ground transportation provided by Big Daddy's limo service"

-----------------------------------------------------------

Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
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From: Mark Horning <mhorning@netcom...>
Subject: Re: Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar?
Date: 12 Aug 2000 02:16:42 GMT
Organization: NETCOM / MindSpring Enterprises, Inc.

In article <<20000809224504.05307.00000346@ng-ft1...>>,
BrianMcCar <<brianmccar@aol...>> wrote:
>Any experiences with guitars on Southwest Airlines?
>
Every time I have checked a guitar on Southwest they have hand carried the
instrument both to and from the cargo hold.

Mark E. Horning "You can not enslave a free man. The most
Physicist you can do is kill him."

Phoenix AZ --Robert A. Heinlein-- (Free Men)


From: JD Blackwell <jd.blackwell@gte...>
Subject: Re: Southwest Airlines to Nashville with guitar?
Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 05:55:17 GMT

I've flown SW in and out of Nashville more than a few times and they will
make an effort to find room in the cabin if the flight's not too full,
otherwise they're very good about gatechecking. Apparently it's such a
common occurrence in Nashville that they have it down to a science.

JD

Mark Horning <<mhorning@netcom...>> wrote in message
news:8n2c2a$987$<1@nntp9...>...
> In article <<20000809224504.05307.00000346@ng-ft1...>>,
> BrianMcCar <<brianmccar@aol...>> wrote:
> >Any experiences with guitars on Southwest Airlines?
> >
> Every time I have checked a guitar on Southwest they have hand carried the
> instrument both to and from the cargo hold.
>
>
> Mark E. Horning "You can not enslave a free man. The most
> Physicist you can do is kill him."
>
> Phoenix AZ --Robert A. Heinlein-- (Free Men)

have the airlines gotten nice??? [2]
From: Stonker7 <stonker7@aol...>
Subject: Re: have the airlines gotten nice???
Date: 04 Oct 2000 13:43:44 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

><chaya@san...> wrote in message <8rdrk4$ndb$<1@nnrp1...>>...
>>I went down the the airport today to make sure that my parlor guitar
>>would fit through the template on the security device & found that they
>>took the template out!!!
>>
>>Is this only San Diego or all over? Doe this mean they'll be nicer
>>about the guitar when I get to board the plane??

The whole deal with the template is an attempt to get passengers to check
over-sized bags at the ticket counters in the main lobby, instead of getting to
the gate and then being told your bag has to be checked.

No, templates are not being removed through out the country.

Having identified myself as a flight attendant before, I've participated on
this topic before and always said bringing a guitar on board isn't as difficult
as everyone seemed to say it was, but no one seemed to want to hear it.

It's nice to read that folks are coming to the conclusion themselves, that
guitars are not a problem, for the most part, to bring onboard the aircraft.

Sure, one has to be rational about what "else" you carry on board "with" your
guitar. The whole deal deal is, if it fits, you can bring it ... and since you
can only carry on 2 bags, be careful how big your other bag is, because you are
already bringing one oversized bag ... your guitar.

I bring my Parlor on all my trips by the way. Get a lot of practice time that
way. And yes, my bags have to fit through the security template as well :-)

Fred Albert


From: Kurt Pennington <kpennington@pyramidsolutions...>
Subject: Re: have the airlines gotten nice???
Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2000 03:41:24 GMT
Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net

I've taken my full size guitar on quite a few airline trips with me.
Believe me... it's a chance you take every time! Just depends on how they
feel that day, or how full the flight is. Sometimes they've made me check
it like baggage, other times they've let me carry it on and place it in the
overhead, other times they've put it in the coat closet and still a few
times they've gate checked it and carried it out to me at the final
desination.

I've had the luck of not having any guitar damage, but the case has been
(hole punch in it), the case did it's job and protected the guitar. When I
complained about the hole, the airlines even bought me a new case.

Though, I feel it's just a roll of the dice each time I take it. Never know
what's going to happen.

O'yeah, in Dallas, they removed the template so I could fit my guitar into
the xray machine also.

Later,
Kurt

<<chaya@san...>> wrote in message news:8rdrk4$ndb$<1@nnrp1...>...
> I went down the the airport today to make sure that my parlor guitar
> would fit through the template on the security device & found that they
> took the template out!!!
>
> Is this only San Diego or all over? Doe this mean they'll be nicer
> about the guitar when I get to board the plane??
>
> csj
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>

Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check? [5]
From: Lumpy <lumpy@digitalcartography...>
Subject: Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check?
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 23:44:23 GMT
Organization: Peak to Peak Internet (peakpeak.com)

The subject came up at the CO RMMGA meeting.
I consider it desirable when the airport staff
makes you show your baggage claim check as it
probably helps discourage theft.

Only two I know of are -
Los Angeles and
Las Vegas

Any others?

lumpy


From: Stonker7 <stonker7@aol...>
Subject: Re: Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check?
Date: 04 Nov 2000 05:09:02 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

>Subject: Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check?

All depends on which airline you're taking.

Out of Love Field in Dallas, Southwest does.

Out of San Juan Puerto Rico, American does, but not at other locations (that
I'm aware of).

I could be wrong, but it depends on which airline is having trouble (folks
inadvertently or "deliberatly" taking wrong bags) out of which airport.

Fred Albert


From: Greg Z <greg_z@my-deja...>
Subject: Re: Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check?
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 19:40:18 GMT
Organization: Deja.com - Before you buy.

In article <<20001104000902.03234.00000048@ng-fw1...>>,

  stonker7@aol.com (Stonker7) wrote:
> >Subject: Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check?
>
> All depends on which airline you're taking.
>
> Out of Love Field in Dallas, Southwest does.
>
> Out of San Juan Puerto Rico, American does, but not at other locations
(that
> I'm aware of).
>
> Fred Albert
>
Fred, several years ago I had to show stubs in Boston, but not for some
time since. Miami also did check (American). That's pretty much my
travel, annual trip to the Caribbean. Or Southwest to BWI for
gatherings, no check for baggage there.

Greg Z
--
"There's bread to win and tolls to pay on Life's Highway"...Steve
Wariner

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.


From: VintgeGuy <vintgeguy@aol...>
Subject: Re: Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check?
Date: 04 Nov 2000 06:38:13 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

<<<Any others?>>>

   San Diego does from time to time, but there's never a checker there all the
time...

Vinny


From: Robert Van Niel <r.van.niel@worldnet...>
Subject: Re: Which Airports Require Showing Baggage Check?
Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 17:23:04 GMT
Organization: AT&T Worldnet

When I travelled to Phoenix two years ago, a claim check was required to
leave the baggage claim area. I assume that policy is still enforced.

Rob

Lumpy wrote:

> The subject came up at the CO RMMGA meeting.
> I consider it desirable when the airport staff
> makes you show your baggage claim check as it
> probably helps discourage theft.
>
> Only two I know of are -
> Los Angeles and
> Las Vegas
>
> Any others?
>
> lumpy

Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question.... [10]
From: Norman Draper <ndraper@prodigy...>
Subject: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 18:26:29 -0500
Organization: Prodigy http://www.prodigy.com

    On my recent ramble down to Texas I took a Collings that I decided I
wouldn't even try to get onto the plane. I figured the Calton case would
put an end to that...
    I gate checked it.  I had to change planes (my first fear was that I'd
never see it again) and wondered if I would pick up the guitar at the gate
when changing planes. Nope... it was put onto the next plane. When I got
to Austin, it went through the regular baggage handling routine. The same
thing on the return trip... gate checked on departure, but regular baggage
the rest of the way.
    Here's the question: is this the usual series of events?  I realize it
eliminates some of the baggage nightmare, but shouldn't I be able to pick it
up at the GATE?? That sort of makes sense to me....
    The Calton case came through with flying colors, in more ways than
one... It is a BRIGHT yellow thing and stands out in a crowd, something I
once heard Christine Lavin talk about. Get a case you see in a congested
place; you can easily spot someone walking away with it.
    But what about this gate check thing?  Anyone had more success than I??
Norman (Was I REALLY Drinking Moonshine??) Draper


From: Larry Pattis <LarryPattis@NoSpamOnRMMGA...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 16:58:59 -0700
Organization: XMission http://www.xmission.com/

In article <8uv66k$38rm$<1@newssvr06-en0...>>, "Norman Draper"
<<ndraper@prodigy...>> wrote:

> On my recent ramble down to Texas I took a Collings that I decided I
> wouldn't even try to get onto the plane. I figured the Calton case would
> put an end to that...
> I gate checked it. I had to change planes (my first fear was that I'd
> never see it again) and wondered if I would pick up the guitar at the gate
> when changing planes. Nope... it was put onto the next plane. When I got
> to Austin, it went through the regular baggage handling routine. The same
> thing on the return trip... gate checked on departure, but regular baggage
> the rest of the way.
> Here's the question: is this the usual series of events? I realize it
> eliminates some of the baggage nightmare, but shouldn't I be able to pick it
> up at the GATE?? That sort of makes sense to me....
> The Calton case came through with flying colors, in more ways than
> one... It is a BRIGHT yellow thing and stands out in a crowd, something I
> once heard Christine Lavin talk about. Get a case you see in a congested
> place; you can easily spot someone walking away with it.
> But what about this gate check thing? Anyone had more success than I??
>
> Norman (Was I REALLY Drinking Moonshine??) Draper

My "gate check" experience has been different than yours, Norman. I have
taken possession of my guitar on the jetway upon arrival. I have no idea
why you ended up having the experience you had!

Nice to have that taxi-cab yellow, case, eh?

Larry Pattis

"Misery is optional"

Lpattis "at" xmission "dot" com


From: <tonegopher@my-deja...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:17:52 GMT
Organization: Deja.com - Before you buy.

In article <8uv66k$38rm$<1@newssvr06-en0...>>,

  "Norman Draper" <ndraper@prodigy.net> wrote:
The windup:

> On my recent ramble down to Texas I took a Collings that I
> decided I wouldn't even try to get onto the plane. I figured
> the Calton case would put an end to that...
> I gate checked it. I had to change planes (my first fear
> was that I'd never see it again) and wondered if I would pick
> up the guitar at the gate when changing planes. Nope... it
> was put onto the next plane. When I got to Austin, it went
> through the regular baggage handling routine. The same
> thing on the return trip... gate checked on departure, but
> regular baggage the rest of the way.

And the pitch!

> Here's the question: is this the usual series of events? I
> realize it eliminates some of the baggage nightmare, but shouldn't
> I be able to pick it up at the GATE??

Hey Norm,

You and other regular rmmga'rs of yesteryear may recall that I used to
be an adamant proponent of gate checking. Yep, used to be.

On my last trip to Maui, I got a real scare. I was toting my gorgeous
little Gallagher in its green Calton case on the trip (what a dandy lil'
beach guitar!) and gate checked it per usual. Fine. First leg of the
trip, no worries. Got off the plane, waited in the conduit, and someone
came up and passed the guitar to me. Wonderful. Next leg, got off the
plane - from the back of the bus (usual slow moving congestion) - and
ACCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK!!! There's my Gallagher sitting by its lonesome in
the breezeway at Los Angeles International Airport just waiting for
anyone with low self-esteem and a hankering for a fine guitar to run off
with it. I cannot express my feelings here. Bottom line was
not-a-good-feeling. I'd much rather have my Calton pick up some
scratches than never see it again. Bad news.

As someone who has been immersed in security training in recent months,
it occurs to me (duh...) that I have NEVER been asked for identification
or a matching ticket when retrieving a gate-checked guitar. Maybe the
airlines are thinking that if enough guitars get stolen that we'll stop
annoying them with requests to gate check instruments. Who knows??? ;/

Looking for another way,

George

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.


From: <dsut@my-deja...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 01:20:56 GMT
Organization: Deja.com - Before you buy.

It seems to depend where in the world you are, I've taken guitars and
photographic equipment all over Asia and never had any problems. When I
make the reservations I ask the travel agent to request the very last row
of seats, there is more than enough spacce to stow a large guitar, even
in a Calton, behind these.

At Check-in I point out that I have a very expensive musical instrument,
which is a lie becuase it is usually a very cheap one (but if it is photo
gear it's very expensive) and that I'd like to gate check it. The most
resistance I've ever had was "Well it's a full plane, sir, and they'll
probably take it from you anyway but you're welcome to try."

It never has been taken from me. Indeed I often get asked if I am on my
way to a gig, on Cathay Pacific I was once asked if I was famous and on
Philippine Airlines I once had to politely turn down a request to
entertain Economy Class.

The exception to the rule is Singapore's Changi airport. A government
regulation, that came into force sometime last year, prevents anyone from
taking anything larger than a large briefcase into the cabin, unless it
is baby related. You could put a frilly bonnet around it and put it in a
push chair but if they spot the ruse I think it's a S$200 spot fine.

I've never carried a guitar through Singapore but I have taken
photographic equipment. The Singapore Airlines staff carefully mark it
all for "special handling" and give me a reciept. At the end of the
journey they carry out and hand it over personally, allowing me to check
everything before before disappearing back into the bowels of the
airport.

The big difference between carrying a guitar and carrying photo equipment
is that with a guitar the stewardesses seem to smile at me a lot more
....or is that just wishfull thinking.

David Sutton

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.


From: Al Carruth <alcarruth@aol...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: 16 Nov 2000 03:35:57 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

I had the same thing happen on a trip last year. I had three guitars in
Caltons. Two went in the 'regular' baggage and one was gate-checked. I never
saw the gate-check when changing planes. When I got to Boston I was told they'd
be carried down to the regular baggage area. Right. I was behind the baggage
chute and heard them arrive: Whump - Whump - Whump! Head first. Needless to say
the cases were opend right there and the goods checked. No problem other than a
real nice ding in the case.

The funny thing is that, most often, when I check those dudes through regular
baggage they hand-carry them anyway. They were real busy that night, with three
flights using the same baggage chute at that time, so I can see why. Still, I
was seething.

Alan Carruth / Luthier
http://www.alcarruthluthier.com


From: <dsut@my-deja...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:20:56 GMT
Organization: Deja.com - Before you buy.

In article <<3a13718f@news...>>,

  "Lumpy" <lumpy@digitalcartography.com> wrote:
.
>
> Please help me to understand what you're
> referring to here. Are you saying that
> there is some kind of space aft of the
> last row of seats? And they let you place
> a guitar there?

Different airlines have different seating configurations. I use Thai
International more often than not and yes there is a space behind the
last row of seats in ecomomy class, otherwise, as you say, the seats
wouldn't recline, on both 747s and Airbus 330s. I can't remember about
767s.

It's not particularly designed for people who want to stick cumbersome
peices of luggage there and the airline doesn't appear to particlarly
ecourage it either. However it is there and I have been allowed to stow
guitars and lighting equipment there. And there is really no need to
fasten it down, it can't go far even in the worst turbulence I've
encountered. Though I would be concerened if it were only in a gig bag.

I'm fairly certain the space also exists on Singapore Airlines, Cathay
Pacific, Malaysian and Philippine Airlines. However I can't say what kind
space may or may not exist on US airlines because I never use them.

As I said it seems to depend on where in the world you are.

David Sutton

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.


From: Destrius <use@the...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:44:59 +0800
Organization: Stratos Entertainment

...and it was written on the heavens that on Thu, 16 Nov 2000 01:20:56 GMT,

 the entity named dsut@my-deja.com (dsut@my-deja.com) 
 inscribed the following words in rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic:
-clip-
>The exception to the rule is Singapore's Changi airport. A government
>regulation, that came into force sometime last year, prevents anyone from
>taking anything larger than a large briefcase into the cabin, unless it
>is baby related. You could put a frilly bonnet around it and put it in a
>push chair but if they spot the ruse I think it's a S$200 spot fine.
-clip-

I brought a dreadnought (in a gig bag) through Changi Airport without any
problems late last year. I brought it in as hand baggage, and nobody
stopped me (or my friend who was carrying a classical). But then we took
Royal Nepal Airlines, not SIA, and they're much more lax than most
airlines.

--
+----------------------------------------------+
| Destrius <dest rius @ big foot.com> |
| http://99s31.hjc.edu.sg/users/harmos +----------------------------+
+---------------------------------------| He walks away, |
| Remove spaces in email address | Leaving nothing |
+---------------------------------------| But a notion of his music. |

                                        +----------------------------+

From: <dsut@my-deja...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:31:56 GMT
Organization: Deja.com - Before you buy.

In article <<raa0v8.scj.ln@127...>>,

  use@the.sig.addy wrote:
> ...and it was written on the heavens that on Thu, 16 Nov 2000 01:20:56 GMT,
> the entity named <dsut@my-deja...> (<dsut@my-deja...>)
> inscribed the following words in rec.music.makers.guitar.acoustic:
>
> -clip-
> >The exception to the rule is Singapore's Changi airport.
>
> I brought a dreadnought (in a gig bag) through Changi Airport without any
> problems late last year. I brought it in as hand baggage, and nobody
> stopped me (or my friend who was carrying a classical). But then we took
> Royal Nepal Airlines, not SIA, and they're much more lax than most
> airlines.

You were were probably very lucky for it is written on the Changi Airport
website:

To ensure that passengers' safety and comfort are not compromised,
airline operators in Singapore have agreed to limit cabin baggage in line
with the Association of Asia Pacific Airlines' Cabin Baggage Regulation
with effect from July 1999 at Singapore Changi Airport.

Similar cabin baggage regulations are also implemented at many airports
around the world.

The following are the cabin baggage allowance at Changi Airport:

Quantity : 1 piece*

Dimension : Length + Breadth + Height (including protrusions)
must not exceed 115cm (or 46 inches) in total, subject to stowability

Weight : Up to 7 kgs

* First and Business Class passengers may be allowed two items, subject
to specific aircraft cabin space and
stowage availability

For Garment Bag,
· Dimensions should not exceed 115cm (or 46 inches)
· Thickness should not exceed 20cm (or 8 inches) when folded

For Briefcase,
· Dimension should not exceed 50cm by 40cm by 25cm (or 20 inches by 16
inches by 10 inches)

In addition to the allowable baggage defined above, other items allowed,
subject to space availability, are:
· laptop computer
· lady's handbag
· overcoat
· crutches/walking stick
· reasonable amount of reading material
· infant's food/carrying basket
· fully collapsible baby stroller (with travelling baby)
· umbrella
· small camera

There are cabin baggage gauges positioned near the check-in counters at
the airport. Passengers are advised to use the gauge to ensure the cabin
baggage meets the requirement.

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.


From: Stonker7 <stonker7@aol...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: 20 Nov 2000 23:35:59 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

>I gate checked it. I had to change planes (my first fear was that I'd
>never see it again) and wondered if I would pick up the guitar at the gate
>when changing planes. Nope... it was put onto the next plane.

Norm,

When gate checking an item at the gate, they usually ask where are you going.
If you have a connection, but you give your final destination, they are going
to tag it to your final destination. They think they are making it easier for
you. It will not automatically be brought up to you at the gate at your final
destination either. At this point, it becomes a standard baggage claim item.

Now, you "could" tell them your destination is your connecting city, but then
you might have to wait a while for your guitar to show up, by then, you might
miss your flight.

The agent has to tag it specially, in order for it to be hand carried up to the
gate where you arrive. This is actually quite a hassle for the baggage
handlers. Usually this is only done with strollers and wheelchairs. The agent
would have to include the information in the computerized flight information
they send to the downline station. The downline station needs to know they need
to send a guy to get your guitar before a cargo buster gets it and throws it
onto the baggage tug.

I think what you're asking, is for your guitar to be brought up to you at your
connecting city, so you can walk it to your next gate, to give it right back to
an agent, to gate check it, so the process starts all over again.

I checked the agents Passenger Service Manual as well as the Baggage Service
Manual in the computer. Couldn't find anything that makes an argument for us to
use, to force them to hand carry our guitars to us everytime we get off one
aircraft, have the guitar handed to us, walk to our next gate, and give our
guitar back to them, get off our connecting flight, and have our guitar handed
to us again.

By the way, the reason skis and golf clubs don't go onto the carousel is not
that they are treated specially and with more care, it's just that they're to
big for the corners and jam up the belt. If the belt gets jammed, we're all up
shit creek. That's why they're hand carried up to the baggage area for pick up.

Pets are really the only items in cargo where everyone busts their butts to
make sure thy're well taken care of. If we kill "Scooter" by negligence, there
are big time ramifications.

I'm just mentioning this as background info, not discourage us, or defend
airline practices. It's actually individuals that make the difference and
somehow get things done when an issue doesn't quite fit proceedure.

I will ask the agents themselves and talk to a pax service manager and see if
their is an alternative. My next trip is Thanksgiving morning so it'll be a few
days.

If I bring my Guild D50 with me on a trip (rarely, now that I have my Parlor) I
always put it in my gigbag and use it as a carry-on. Never had a problem. But
of course if there "was" a problem, and I did have to check it, it's only a
Guild, not a $3,000 guitar. Also, agents are more reluctant to force a pax to
place an obviously fragile (guitar in a gigback) item in the cargo area. They
will usually make more of an effort to "find space in the cabin". It's also
easier for them, if space in the cabin can be found ... less work for them.

So I'll get back with whatever info I have by the 25th.

Fred Albert


From: Stonker7 <stonker7@aol...>
Subject: Re: Gate Checking, The Calton Challange, And A Question....
Date: 21 Nov 2000 04:45:20 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

>Good luck, Fred. Hope you don't end up with a bunch of toothpicks.

I'm confident I won't. The airline folks are just like us at rmmga .... trying
to do the best we can. One day at a time ;-)

Fred Albert

Guitar Insurance?
From: John Sorell <jsorell@bouldernews...>
Subject: Re: Guitar Insurance?
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 17:36:22 GMT
Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net

Lumpy wrote:
>
> Any of you guys that travel with your
> good guitars, can you tell me what you
> know about insurance against damage/theft?
>
> Airline liability limit is $250. My homeowners
> doesn't kick in till the deductable of $1,000.
>
> Anyone know of a policy that covers replacement
> cost with little or no deductable?
>
> Tnx - lumpy

If you charge your ticket on American Express they insure the
replacement cost of all checked items.

John

United Airlines Does Good [6]
From: Lumpy <lumpy@digitalcartography...>
Subject: United Airlines Does Good
Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 01:27:51 GMT
Organization: Peak to Peak Internet (peakpeak.com)

I made my Denver to LA flight with the Lowden
today. All went better than I could have
expected.

At check in -
This Hiscox case has never flown before
so I asked the guy "This is a new case,
could I get a new 'FRAGILE' sticker?"

He gave me a whole roll of them and
offered to let me put them on wherever
I liked. I put them on all 'faces' of
the case, so that the guerillas could
see the bright red sticker from any angle.

I sat the case on the conveyor and he said
"Oh I'm not going to let that go down the
chute. I'll call and have it hand carried"

I'm starting to think, OK!..:-)

At the destination (LAX):
The luggage arrived before me and the rest
of the passengers. There was a UAL employee
standing by the guitar case looking at it.
When I got there and picked it up, she told
me that she saw it come out of the plane
and personally went and got it and hand
carried it to the oversized bagged area.
She waited with it till I got there and
then verified my claim check. None of
that was her job at all, she is one of
the agents that take tickets at the gate.
"Now boarding rows 35 and higher, etc...".

Then when I left the baggage area, there
was the regular LAX/UAL guy checking claim
checks as I left the baggage area.

The guitar made it just fine. Thanks United
Airlines..:-)

Friendly sky guy...lumpy


From: Chris Stern <chris@falsgrave...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines Does Good
Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 08:45:46 GMT

I have a new policy. I tell them that I'm ALWAYS allowed to carry my guitar
on. Despite some consternation at check in this works. A grumble or 2 that
the plane is full etc BUT the key is to get a seat AT THE BACK so you get
called first and can find an empty overhead baggage locker.

--
Chris Stern

Still Crazy...........
"Lumpy" <<lumpy@digitalcartography...>> wrote in message
news:<3a1f19d0@news...>...
> I made my Denver to LA flight with the Lowden
> today. All went better than I could have
> expected.
>
> At check in -
> This Hiscox case has never flown before
> so I asked the guy "This is a new case,
> could I get a new 'FRAGILE' sticker?"
>
> He gave me a whole roll of them and
> offered to let me put them on wherever
> I liked. I put them on all 'faces' of
> the case, so that the guerillas could
> see the bright red sticker from any angle.
>
> I sat the case on the conveyor and he said
> "Oh I'm not going to let that go down the
> chute. I'll call and have it hand carried"
>
> I'm starting to think, OK!..:-)
>
> At the destination (LAX):
> The luggage arrived before me and the rest
> of the passengers. There was a UAL employee
> standing by the guitar case looking at it.
> When I got there and picked it up, she told
> me that she saw it come out of the plane
> and personally went and got it and hand
> carried it to the oversized bagged area.
> She waited with it till I got there and
> then verified my claim check. None of
> that was her job at all, she is one of
> the agents that take tickets at the gate.
> "Now boarding rows 35 and higher, etc...".
>
> Then when I left the baggage area, there
> was the regular LAX/UAL guy checking claim
> checks as I left the baggage area.
>
> The guitar made it just fine. Thanks United
> Airlines..:-)
>
> Friendly sky guy...lumpy
>
>


From: Kent Fishburn <fish@inil...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines Does Good
Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 07:10:50 -0600

I've flown United out of and into Chicago with my guitar a couple times and
have had good experiences. On one occasion, I was told to take it to the
gate with me and they would hand check it. My seat was in the back of the
plane so I was the last off when we arrived at Ohare. I inquired at the desk
about my guitar and was told it would be in baggage, but I was the last one
there and most bags were already gone and no guitar. While frantically
searching the other conveyors to see if it had been misplaced, the copilot
strolled up with guitar in hand. "You gotta play something before I let you
leave with this." I thanked him for taking care of it, played a little
Embryonic Journey and thanked him again. He happened to be a guitar player
also, and an appreciative listner.

Kent Fishburn

"Lumpy" <<lumpy@digitalcartography...>> wrote in message
news:<3a1f19d0@news...>...
> I made my Denver to LA flight with the Lowden
> today. All went better than I could have
> expected.
>
> At check in -
> This Hiscox case has never flown before
> so I asked the guy "This is a new case,
> could I get a new 'FRAGILE' sticker?"
>
> He gave me a whole roll of them and
> offered to let me put them on wherever
> I liked. I put them on all 'faces' of
> the case, so that the guerillas could
> see the bright red sticker from any angle.
>
> I sat the case on the conveyor and he said
> "Oh I'm not going to let that go down the
> chute. I'll call and have it hand carried"
>
> I'm starting to think, OK!..:-)
>
> At the destination (LAX):
> The luggage arrived before me and the rest
> of the passengers. There was a UAL employee
> standing by the guitar case looking at it.
> When I got there and picked it up, she told
> me that she saw it come out of the plane
> and personally went and got it and hand
> carried it to the oversized bagged area.
> She waited with it till I got there and
> then verified my claim check. None of
> that was her job at all, she is one of
> the agents that take tickets at the gate.
> "Now boarding rows 35 and higher, etc...".
>
> Then when I left the baggage area, there
> was the regular LAX/UAL guy checking claim
> checks as I left the baggage area.
>
> The guitar made it just fine. Thanks United
> Airlines..:-)
>
> Friendly sky guy...lumpy
>
>


From: Lumpy <lumpy@digitalcartography...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines Does Good
Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 15:18:06 GMT
Organization: Peak to Peak Internet (peakpeak.com)

Kent Fishburn wrote:
> ...While frantically searching the other conveyors
> to see if it had been misplaced, the copilot
> strolled up with guitar in hand...

Maybe we should all start telling the ticket
agent "This is the pilot's guitar!"

This week in Newport Beach...lumpy


From: Hank Alinger <hoink@home...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines Does Good
Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2000 16:04:06 GMT
Organization: Excite@Home - The Leader in Broadband http://home.com/faster

Lumpy:

> At the destination (LAX):
> The luggage arrived before me and the rest
> of the passengers. There was a UAL employee
> standing by the guitar case looking at it.
> When I got there and picked it up, she told
> me that she saw it come out of the plane
> and personally went and got it and hand
> carried it to the oversized bagged area.
> The guitar made it just fine. Thanks United
> Airlines..:-)
>
> Friendly sky guy...lumpy

I had a similar experience with USAir recently. I flew to Houstion
(for TX-1) with the Kinscherff, which was checked in a Taylor box,
packed in it's hardshell case and further protected by a soft case
cover.

After arriving in Houston, I waited and waited for the box...and finally
decided some baggage handler just got a great guitar...

I walked over to the baggage office and the agent says: "We didn't want
to put that on a the belt sir, so we carried it in here for you."

OK, thanks!

Hank Alinger


From: <chaya@san...>
Subject: Re: United Airlines Does Good
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 20:55:18 GMT
Organization: Deja.com - Before you buy.

Two weeks ago I flew up to San Jose with my Baby Collings in a gig bag
instead of its hard shell case. American Airlines gave me no trouble at
all about bringing it on board & so we both arrived happily & safely.

The only trouble I got was from a fellow traveler who thought the space
should have been for her oversized garment bag instead. All my luck, she
sat in the middle seat next to me & grumbled all the way back to San
Diego.

But I was all prepared if American was going to give me a hard time. I
would have just said Fred Albert said it was ok & walked on with a
smile.

csj

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

How to travel with guitars on a plane.... [3]
From: Tony <tonio@jps...>
Subject: How to travel with guitars on a plane....
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 10:09:13 -0800
Organization: Treehouse Software

I've brought an old acoustic in a gig bag on flights before without a
problem...flight attendants never asked, and it fit nicely in the overhead
storage, but now I need to take my good J-1 Martin and a P Bass on a trip.
I know I can't bring the bass aboard, so I think I'll need to find a box to
fit the case in and check it as baggage, or just pack foam inside and check
it without a box around the case. Any other thoughts are welcome.
Has anyone ever brought a hardshell acoustic case on a flight? I'm thinking
I'll have to pick up a gig bag to get it on board....just don't feel good
about checking it as baggage.


From: No Busking <nobusking@yahoo...>
Subject: Re: How to travel with guitars on a plane....
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:11:37 GMT
Organization: Deja.com

Tony asked:
> Has anyone ever brought a hardshell acoustic case on a flight? I'm
thinking
> I'll have to pick up a gig bag to get it on board....just don't feel
good
> about checking it as baggage.

Yes, and your success in carrying it on relies on several things...some
of which are in your control, some are not. I'd bring it to the
airport prepared to check it (i.e. in a hard case, not a gig bag), then
do the following to improve your chances...

1. Don't bring any other significant carry-on luggage. Maybe a small
backpack or bag, but nothing else.

2. Don't call attention to it when you check in.

3. If they do notice or ask about it at check-in, smile and be very
nice. Tell them it's very valuable to you, that you'd really like to
carry it on, and that you haven't brought any other carry-on luggage
along. If all else fails, ask for a "gate check", then try again when
boarding the plane.

Do not get angry or yell...no matter what. The agents at check-in and
the gate completely control your destiny on this matter. Pissing them
off does NOT help.

4. If they stop you at the metal detector (some airports have
templates on the conveyor belt that are too small for guitars to pass
through), tell them you are gate checking the instrument. They might
send you back to the airline for a tag...go back to the airline check-
in desk and see number 3 above.

Depending on the airline, airport, aircraft, mood of the gate agent and
flight attendents, and alignment of the moon and stars, you will
PROBABLY be able to carry the instrument on. The worst that will
PROBABLY happen is handing it to someone when you board the plane, and
having it handed back when you de-plane.

It is possible, though, that you'll have to check it normally and watch
it come out on the conveyor belt with the rest of the luggage. If that
happens, inspect the instrument THOROUGHLY before leaving the
airport...if there's any damage, reporting it immediately will greatly
improve your chances of collecting compensation.

I'm reliably informed that many airlines now cover damaged luggage up
to $2500...although it's not clear to me if this applies to non-ATA
guitar cases. A friend was recently compensated replacement value for
his Martin D-28 that was destroyed as checked luggage, and he just had
a normal case.

Not trying to scare you, just trying to inform.

Michael Pugh

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/


From: <chrisc@blueridge...>
Subject: Re: How to travel with guitars on a plane....
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 21:06:52 GMT
Organization: Deja.com

Michael gives excellent advice, and sometime ago someone (I think it
was Larry Pattis) suggested putting duct tape over all latches to help
keep them from inadvertantly popping. I actually put several windings
of strapping tape around the outside neck near the center of the case,
so just in case the latches pop, the guitar doesn't tumble out.

I haven't had any trouble getting a hardshell guitar on board, but like
Michael suggests, try to carry nothing else so it will be viewed as
your "only" carry on. If the plane is packed you'll likely encounter
more resistance. Try to board as early as possible so you can get first
crack at an overhead bin. Kinda problematic to board last and find all
overhead bins with something in them and not enough room left for the
guitar. It works better to get your guitar in an overhead bin early and
let others "pack" their smaller stuff around it.

Delta and USA Airways has been pretty decent to me about it.

Hope this helps,

Chris

In article <944u9e$g2c$<1@nnrp1...>>,

  No Busking <nobusking@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Tony asked:
> > Has anyone ever brought a hardshell acoustic case on a flight? I'm
> thinking
> > I'll have to pick up a gig bag to get it on board....just don't feel
> good
> > about checking it as baggage.
>
> Yes, and your success in carrying it on relies on several
things...some
> of which are in your control, some are not. I'd bring it to the
> airport prepared to check it (i.e. in a hard case, not a gig bag),
then
> do the following to improve your chances...
>
> 1. Don't bring any other significant carry-on luggage. Maybe a small
> backpack or bag, but nothing else.
>
> 2. Don't call attention to it when you check in.
>
> 3. If they do notice or ask about it at check-in, smile and be very
> nice. Tell them it's very valuable to you, that you'd really like to
> carry it on, and that you haven't brought any other carry-on luggage
> along. If all else fails, ask for a "gate check", then try again when
> boarding the plane.
>
> Do not get angry or yell...no matter what. The agents at check-in and
> the gate completely control your destiny on this matter. Pissing them
> off does NOT help.
>
> 4. If they stop you at the metal detector (some airports have
> templates on the conveyor belt that are too small for guitars to pass
> through), tell them you are gate checking the instrument. They might
> send you back to the airline for a tag...go back to the airline check-
> in desk and see number 3 above.
>
> Depending on the airline, airport, aircraft, mood of the gate agent
and
> flight attendents, and alignment of the moon and stars, you will
> PROBABLY be able to carry the instrument on. The worst that will
> PROBABLY happen is handing it to someone when you board the plane, and
> having it handed back when you de-plane.
>
> It is possible, though, that you'll have to check it normally and
watch
> it come out on the conveyor belt with the rest of the luggage. If
that
> happens, inspect the instrument THOROUGHLY before leaving the
> airport...if there's any damage, reporting it immediately will greatly
> improve your chances of collecting compensation.
>
> I'm reliably informed that many airlines now cover damaged luggage up
> to $2500...although it's not clear to me if this applies to non-ATA
> guitar cases. A friend was recently compensated replacement value for
> his Martin D-28 that was destroyed as checked luggage, and he just had
> a normal case.
>
> Not trying to scare you, just trying to inform.
>
> Michael Pugh
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/
>

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/

Article on flying with a guitar [4]
From: Tom Loredo <loredo@spacenet...>
Subject: Article on flying with a guitar
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 17:26:21 -0500
Organization: Cornell University

Hi folks-

My honey keeps an eye out for me and my Olson, so this article on a travel
web site caught her attention. It features some recommendations from
Harvey Reid. Ironically (in view of the press UPS gets here), one of
his recommendations is to ship your guitar to your destination via UPS!

http://www.trip.com/completetraveler/article/0,1355,1-1-4,00.html
Flying by your Instruments
by Marty Jones - January 08, 2001

In the article Reid also says he avoids signing a baggage waiver by
using Calton cases. But the last time I looked into this, there were
no cases for guitars that were ATA-authorized, so no matter how you
pack your guitar, the airline can declare it "improperly packed" and
require you to sign the form. Does anyone know if this has changed?

Peace,
Tom Loredo


From: Steve & Caren Comeau <notcomeaus@home...>
Subject: Re: Article on flying with a guitar
Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 17:34:15 GMT
Organization: Excite@Home - The Leader in Broadband http://home.com/faster

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the link to that article.

It's interesting that they say it costs about $30 to ship an instrument.
This has been my usual experience. I've shipped my guitar 6 times via
FedEx, but the most recent time they charged more than $50 - saying that it
was an oversized package. You can plug the dimensions of your shipping box
into the UPS or FedEx on-line shipping charge calculators and it will advise
you if it's oversized. I did and technically FedEx was right. I challenged
the charge based on the fact they shipped it out for only approximately $30
and they refunded the difference - this time.

Basically, it changes the economics of shipping a guitar to a workshop, or
gig, and back from $60 to $100.

Just a warning.

Steve

Tom Loredo wrote in message <<3A68BF0D.D47F6AE1@spacenet...>>...
>
>Hi folks-
>
>My honey keeps an eye out for me and my Olson, so this article on a travel
>web site caught her attention. It features some recommendations from
>Harvey Reid. Ironically (in view of the press UPS gets here), one of
>his recommendations is to ship your guitar to your destination via UPS!
>
>http://www.trip.com/completetraveler/article/0,1355,1-1-4,00.html
>Flying by your Instruments
>by Marty Jones - January 08, 2001
>
>In the article Reid also says he avoids signing a baggage waiver by
>using Calton cases. But the last time I looked into this, there were
>no cases for guitars that were ATA-authorized, so no matter how you
>pack your guitar, the airline can declare it "improperly packed" and
>require you to sign the form. Does anyone know if this has changed?
>
>Peace,
>Tom Loredo


From: Bruce Smith <baabin@earthlink...>
Subject: Re: Article on flying with a guitar
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 20:01:14 GMT
Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net

Another good area for information is:

http://www.win.net/~mainstring/carryon.html

Smitty

Tom Loredo wrote:
>
> Hi folks-
>
> My honey keeps an eye out for me and my Olson, so this article on a travel
> web site caught her attention. It features some recommendations from
> Harvey Reid. Ironically (in view of the press UPS gets here), one of
> his recommendations is to ship your guitar to your destination via UPS!
>
> http://www.trip.com/completetraveler/article/0,1355,1-1-4,00.html
> Flying by your Instruments
> by Marty Jones - January 08, 2001
>
> In the article Reid also says he avoids signing a baggage waiver by
> using Calton cases. But the last time I looked into this, there were
> no cases for guitars that were ATA-authorized, so no matter how you
> pack your guitar, the airline can declare it "improperly packed" and
> require you to sign the form. Does anyone know if this has changed?
>
> Peace,
> Tom Loredo


From: Steve Hawkins <stephen.m.hawkins@tek...>
Subject: Re: Article on flying with a guitar
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 20:20:10 GMT
Organization: Tektronix Inc.

>Tom Loredo wrote:
>>
>> Hi folks-
>>
>> My honey keeps an eye out for me and my Olson, so this article on a travel
>> web site caught her attention. It features some recommendations from
>> Harvey Reid. Ironically (in view of the press UPS gets here), one of
>> his recommendations is to ship your guitar to your destination via UPS!
>>
>> http://www.trip.com/completetraveler/article/0,1355,1-1-4,00.html
>> Flying by your Instruments
>> by Marty Jones - January 08, 2001
>>
>> In the article Reid also says he avoids signing a baggage waiver by
>> using Calton cases. But the last time I looked into this, there were
>> no cases for guitars that were ATA-authorized, so no matter how you
>> pack your guitar, the airline can declare it "improperly packed" and
>> require you to sign the form. Does anyone know if this has changed?
>>
>> Peace,
>> Tom Loredo

Tom, I've never been asked to sign a baggage waiver when flying with my
Calton's. I was asked once if I had loosened the strings and said Yes even
though I don't loosen them when I fly.

Steve Hawkins

Airline or UPS? [5]
From: JPAltes <jpaltes@aol...>
Subject: Airline or UPS?
Date: 22 Jan 2001 21:26:03 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Which is safer... transporting a guitar in a hardshell case, "checking it
through"... or sending it through UPS or some other carrier?

Pat Altes


From: Brian Corll <bc@bcsql...>
Subject: Re: Airline or UPS?
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:42:34 GMT

Heart attack time ! Please not UPS ! They lost my guitar completely ! Try
Fed Ex.

--
--------------------
Brian Corll

Don't believe everything you think !
"JPAltes" <<jpaltes@aol...>> wrote in message
news:<20010122162603.07477.00000666@ng-ct1...>...
> Which is safer... transporting a guitar in a hardshell case, "checking it
> through"... or sending it through UPS or some other carrier?
>
>
> Pat Altes


From: Hojo2x <hojo2x@aol...>
Subject: Re: Airline or UPS?
Date: 22 Jan 2001 23:05:07 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Pat Altes wrote:

>Which is safer... transporting a guitar in a hardshell case, "checking
it>through"... or sending it through UPS or some other carrier?

Well, you can save money and have better protection for your instrument if you
go for a "poor man's Calton case" : loosen the strings, wrap the neck and
peghead of your guitar in a tee shirt or other soft cloth, put it in its
hardshell case and lock it, then pack the case in a cardboard shipping
container (available at most music stores) that you've padded with crumpled
newspapers. Tape it up, print your name and address (and travel contact info,
if you have it) in Magic Marker right on the cardboard, then check it through.

I've shipped my instrument ahead by UPS route when I've traveled, only to have
them misplace it for a week. Putting the guitar in its case in a cardboard
shipping container and checking it as luggage is much safer, at least in my
experience.

The main drawback is that the box is cumbersome. But that's how I've flown
with my McAlister baritone acoustic guitar, and it's worked just fine every
time.

Hope this helps.

Wade Hampton Miller

PS The bit about loosening the strings is debatable - there's a current school
of thought that this somehow endangers the guitar, and that you should leave
the guitar tuned to full tension.

I'm not trying to stir up any debate on that, I'll just point out that the
airlines still require any guitars that get checked through to have been
detuned. Since those folks will use ANY exuse to avoid paying for instruments
they damage, I choose to avoid handing them THAT exuse on a silver platter.


From: Steve & Caren Comeau <notcomeaus@home...>
Subject: Re: Airline or UPS?
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:12:12 GMT
Organization: Excite@Home - The Leader in Broadband http://home.com/faster

Hey Wade,

Did you cut a little handle in the box? I picked that tip up from
frets.com. You find the balance point of your packed guitar and cut a "C"
shaped hole for a handle. Makes the box a lot easier to manage.

Just before you check it, you can pull the cardboard back out of the handle
and tape it shut with some packing tape to reduce the chance the hole will
snag something in transit. Not perfect, but effective.

Steve

Hojo2x wrote in message <<20010122180507.29909.00000735@ng-fs1...>>...
>Pat Altes wrote:
>
>>Which is safer... transporting a guitar in a hardshell case, "checking
>it>through"... or sending it through UPS or some other carrier?
>
>
>Well, you can save money and have better protection for your instrument if
you
>go for a "poor man's Calton case" : loosen the strings, wrap the neck and
>peghead of your guitar in a tee shirt or other soft cloth, put it in its
>hardshell case and lock it, then pack the case in a cardboard shipping
>container (available at most music stores) that you've padded with crumpled
>newspapers. Tape it up, print your name and address (and travel contact
info,
>if you have it) in Magic Marker right on the cardboard, then check it
through.
>
>I've shipped my instrument ahead by UPS route when I've traveled, only to
have
>them misplace it for a week. Putting the guitar in its case in a cardboard
>shipping container and checking it as luggage is much safer, at least in my
>experience.
>
>The main drawback is that the box is cumbersome. But that's how I've flown
>with my McAlister baritone acoustic guitar, and it's worked just fine every
>time.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>
>Wade Hampton Miller
>
>
>PS The bit about loosening the strings is debatable - there's a current
school
>of thought that this somehow endangers the guitar, and that you should
leave
>the guitar tuned to full tension.
>
>I'm not trying to stir up any debate on that, I'll just point out that the
>airlines still require any guitars that get checked through to have been
>detuned. Since those folks will use ANY exuse to avoid paying for
instruments
>they damage, I choose to avoid handing them THAT exuse on a silver platter.


From: Spike <rich.watkins@/remove/mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Airline or UPS?
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 03:04:56 -0500
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises

I ordered my dream guitar from Elderly, a Larivee OM-10. UPS delivered the
remains in a timely manner. I eventually got a refund, but that's not the
point, is it?

Rich
"JPAltes" <<jpaltes@aol...>> wrote in message
news:<20010122162603.07477.00000666@ng-ct1...>...
> Which is safer... transporting a guitar in a hardshell case, "checking it
> through"... or sending it through UPS or some other carrier?
>
>
> Pat Altes

airlines and guitars (again) [4]
From: Kurt Penner <kurt.penner@home...>
Subject: airlines and guitars (again)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 05:07:03 GMT
Organization: Excite@Home - The Leader in Broadband http://home.com/faster

Hi all,

I just got back from a much needed vacation in Palm Springs and thought I'd
share a couple of observations from my plane flights.

Despite the usenet telling me that it's damn near impossible to get a guitar
into the cabin of an airliner, I saw three separate people successfully do
so. Each was carrying a fairly compact soft nylon case, and appeared to
carry the guitar into the cabin with no gate checking at all.

I spoke with the last of these three chaps who happened to be on the same
flight as me, and he explained that he frequently flew with his budget
classical in this fashion and never had any problems. He stated plainly to
me that "it fits in the overhead bin". He once was asked to stash it in the
"closet" at the end of the cabin. He did admit that his experience was
limited to Northwest and KLM airlines. He also admitted that he would never
try this with a valuable instrument. I wondered if the staff were more
lenient with him because it was his only carry-on item.

Are the airlines becoming more lenient? Does the soft case make the
difference, being smaller, or perhaps looking more like carry-on baggage?
Don't those cursed steel frames at the check-in counter that demonstrate the
size of carry-on luggage matter?

Kurt Penner


From: Larry Sprigg <gsprigg@aol...>
Subject: Re: airlines and guitars (again)
Date: 18 Apr 2001 11:55:27 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

I used to carry a Baby Taylor on trips. About 5:00 a.m. one morning on a
layover in Heathrow (London) to Dubai I was jamming with a young German guy who
carried a small (00 size) guitar in a gig bag. He said he had no trouble with
it as a carry-on on European flights.

Go figure!!!

Larry

To reply via E-Mail, please remove the "nojunk" from my address


From: Kevin Van Sant <kvansant@pobox...>
Subject: Re: airlines and guitars (again)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2001 14:15:19 GMT
Organization: Road Runner - NC

On Wed, 18 Apr 2001 05:07:03 GMT, "Kurt Penner" <<kurt.penner@home...>>
wrote in message <Xh9D6.5655$<4I5.543888@news1...>> :

>Hi all,
>
>I just got back from a much needed vacation in Palm Springs and thought I'd
>share a couple of observations from my plane flights.
>
>Despite the usenet telling me that it's damn near impossible to get a guitar
>into the cabin of an airliner, I saw three separate people successfully do
>so. Each was carrying a fairly compact soft nylon case, and appeared to
>carry the guitar into the cabin with no gate checking at all.
>
>I spoke with the last of these three chaps who happened to be on the same
>flight as me, and he explained that he frequently flew with his budget
>classical in this fashion and never had any problems. He stated plainly to
>me that "it fits in the overhead bin". He once was asked to stash it in the
>"closet" at the end of the cabin. He did admit that his experience was
>limited to Northwest and KLM airlines. He also admitted that he would never
>try this with a valuable instrument. I wondered if the staff were more
>lenient with him because it was his only carry-on item.
>
>Are the airlines becoming more lenient? Does the soft case make the
>difference, being smaller, or perhaps looking more like carry-on baggage?
>Don't those cursed steel frames at the check-in counter that demonstrate the
>size of carry-on luggage matter?
>

This topic has a big section devoted to it in the FAQ of the jazz
guitar group (I see this is crossposted) Someone else will have to
chime in with that URL.

I think airlines are, if anything, cracking down harder on carry on
bags, but still I've never had any problem getting my guitar in the
cabin with me. The main thing is just don't call any attention to the
fact that you've got it.

I also just discovered that it's a good idea to book your flights over
the phone so that you can finagle your itinerary to make sure that
every flight involved is on a plane large enough to have sizeable
overhead bins. Some of the little commuter hoppers for instance
probably don't have room. I've found the airline people on the phone
to be guitar friendly, the people on the plane to be guitar friendly,
the people at the gate guitar neutral, and the people at the check in
counter to be decidedly guitar unfriendly.

_________________________________________
Kevin Van Sant
jazz guitar

http://www.onestopjazz.com/kvansant
to buy my CDs, listen to sound clips, and get more info.

http://www.onestopjazz.com
for a comprehensive index of internet jazz resources


From: Tom Walls <tw25@cornell...>
Subject: Re: airlines and guitars (again)
Date: 18 Apr 2001 14:50:40 GMT
Organization: Cornell University

In article <<gs7rdt45ake8j108od047qn6gs3teigb91@4ax...>>, <kvansant@pobox...>
says...
>
>
>This topic has a big section devoted to it in the FAQ of the jazz
>guitar group (I see this is crossposted) Someone else will have to
>chime in with that URL.

That would be me -- here we go http://www-ifia.fzk.de/JazzGuitar/rmmgjFAQ.html
--
Tom Walls
the guy at the Temple of Zeus
http://www.arts.cornell.edu/zeus/
____________________________________________________________________
the rmb troll faq is at http://liquid2k.net/rmbtroll. spread the word!

Airlines/guitar question. [3]
From: Dennisgl <dg22642@navix...>
Subject: Re: Airlines/guitar question.
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 05:39:39 -0700
Organization: Navix Internet Subscribers

I just bought a Larrivee parlor to take on a trip on America West. I
had no problems carrying it on the aircraft. Both my flights were
completly full and the parlor fit nicely in the overhead compartment.

Dennis, trapped in the cornfields of Nebraska, Gulley.

JS wrote:

> Has anyone found airlines that are more/less guitar friendly? I'm
> visiting the Bay area, want to play some open mics when I'm there.
>
> I'm also considering shipping it out.
> Jeff S.


From: News <folkindetroit@aol...>
Subject: Re: Airlines/guitar question.
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 23:41:47 -0300
Organization: Verio

 Most airlines are really fine with it.  United has a policy not allowing
instruments in the overhead.. The main reason being that if the aircraft
enters CAT (Clear Air Turbulence) or encounters a rough ride, They don't
want to be held liable for an instrument inadvertently falling out of the
overhead and hurting a passenger or cabin crew member.

Ask for a seat toward the rear. That way will be among the first to board
and have a choice of overhead slots to put you guitar. I sometimes
pre-board. They are pretty okay with that too realizing that you are
carrying the tool of your trade. (If applicable).

"Dennisgl" <<dg22642@navix...>> wrote in message
news:<3B2B538B.A677262C@navix...>...
> I just bought a Larrivee parlor to take on a trip on America West. I
> had no problems carrying it on the aircraft. Both my flights were
> completly full and the parlor fit nicely in the overhead compartment.
>
> Dennis, trapped in the cornfields of Nebraska, Gulley.
>
> JS wrote:
>
> > Has anyone found airlines that are more/less guitar friendly? I'm
> > visiting the Bay area, want to play some open mics when I'm there.
> >
> > I'm also considering shipping it out.
> > Jeff S.
>


From: Adrian Legg <commercial-free@speech...>
Subject: Re: Airlines/guitar question.
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:25:18 +0100

On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 3:41:47 +0100, News wrote
(in message <qMeX6.10107$<DW1.414552@iad-read...>>):

> Most airlines are really fine with it.

Getting a vague, cosy impression lately that things might have eased
somewhat, I asked my repair person if he was seeing any less airline damage
in his work.
The answer was "No, definitely not".
Also, the UA cabin baggage scanner template was still in place at JFK 8 days
ago.
See the archives for horror stories.

--
www.adrianlegg.com

Flight Case for rent? [3]
From: Hojo2x <hojo2x@aol...>
Subject: Re: Flight Case for rent?
Date: 28 Jul 2001 20:57:07 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Steve Roman wrote:

>I'm flying up to the SF Bay Area soon and wonder if anyone in the San>Diego,
CA area might have a Calton (or similar) flight case for rent>for 3-4 days.

Well, good luck on your quest, Steve. I have to tell you that I have doubts
that anyone would let their Calton out of their possession, though. I know I
wouldn't rent or loan mine to anyone, not even a dear friend. (Well, MAYBE a
dear friend. But I'd have to think about it....)

If you don't get any takers on your request, my suggestion is that you use "the
poor man's Calton case," which is a cardboard guitar shipping box with your
regular hardshell case inside.

First, prepare your guitar. Despite some lively discussion on this newsgroup
whether it's proper to loosen the strings, I always do, because the airlines
require it. I wrap the neck and peghead in a tee shirt, too. Then put it in
its case and latch it. Put the case in the shipping box.

Pad around the case with crumpled newspapers or styrofoam peanuts, like you
would if you were mailing it. Then tape it up and put your name and address
(or destination address) on a label and slap it on.

I've done this many times. It's never failed me.

One refinement to this technique that I picked up on this newsgroup is to cut a
U-shaped "handle" out of the cardboard at the balance point. You carry some
tape in your carry-on with you, and when checking the guitar box you can close
that up, but when you're lugging it through the airport it really helps to have
that to carry it with.

Hope this helps.

Wade Hampton Miller


From: RonH <sfdilu@yahoo...>
Subject: Re: Flight Case for rent?
Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2001 02:01:43 GMT
Organization: AT&T Worldnet

Steve,

From one who has traveled around the world lugging an acoustic (brazil,
Egypt, Israel, Azores, Greece, Italy, Spain, w. Africa, Portugal, Hawaii,
England, France etc. etc.) I'll have to agree with Wade. My typical travel
case has been a cheap hard case inside a cardboard guitar shipping box.
I've had to re-fiberglass the case a few times but have never sustained any
damage to the guitar itself. I wouldn't have a second thought about going
from SD to SF. Of course as soon as I say that you'll run in to the baggage
handler from hell.

Good luck but don't sweat it too much,

Ron

"Hojo2x" <<hojo2x@aol...>> wrote in message
news:<20010728165707.12518.00001548@ng-fq1...>...
> Steve Roman wrote:
>
> >I'm flying up to the SF Bay Area soon and wonder if anyone in the
San>Diego,
> CA area might have a Calton (or similar) flight case for rent>for 3-4
days.
>
>
> Well, good luck on your quest, Steve. I have to tell you that I have
doubts
> that anyone would let their Calton out of their possession, though. I
know I
> wouldn't rent or loan mine to anyone, not even a dear friend. (Well,
MAYBE a
> dear friend. But I'd have to think about it....)
>
> If you don't get any takers on your request, my suggestion is that you use
"the
> poor man's Calton case," which is a cardboard guitar shipping box with
your
> regular hardshell case inside.
>
> First, prepare your guitar. Despite some lively discussion on this
newsgroup
> whether it's proper to loosen the strings, I always do, because the
airlines
> require it. I wrap the neck and peghead in a tee shirt, too. Then put it
in
> its case and latch it. Put the case in the shipping box.
>
> Pad around the case with crumpled newspapers or styrofoam peanuts, like
you
> would if you were mailing it. Then tape it up and put your name and
address
> (or destination address) on a label and slap it on.
>
> I've done this many times. It's never failed me.
>
> One refinement to this technique that I picked up on this newsgroup is to
cut a
> U-shaped "handle" out of the cardboard at the balance point. You carry
some
> tape in your carry-on with you, and when checking the guitar box you can
close
> that up, but when you're lugging it through the airport it really helps to
have
> that to carry it with.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>
> Wade Hampton Miller


From: Hojo2x <hojo2x@aol...>
Subject: Re: Flight Case for rent?
Date: 29 Jul 2001 03:20:55 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Ron H wrote:

>From one who has traveled around the world lugging an acoustic

>I'll have to agree with Wade. My typical travel>case has been a cheap hard
case inside a cardboard guitar shipping box.

Well, my own feeling is that a true flight case like a Calton is best, and is
certainly less cumbersome than the "hard case in a shipping box" routine. I
also live in Alaska, where the Calton cases are really nice for thermal
protection.

But I'm a multi-instrumentalist, and I simply can't afford to equip every
instrument I own with a Calton case even though (as it happens) I'm now a
Calton case dealer. So I use the cardboard shipping box trick whenever I have
to transport an instrument that doesn't have a Calton.

Wade Hampton Miller

Airlines and guitars.. [14]
From: Ed Bianchi <ebianchi@enounce...>
Subject: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2001 20:35:38 -0700
Organization: Enounce, Inc. http://www.enounce.com

Hello all, I have not posted in a while, but need some advice..

I saw the post on Parlour guitars and airlines, and wanted to know how
people handle full size guitars in a hard cases...

I will be flying across the USA in a little while, and want to bring my
good guitar (a Larrivee LV-10). Should I send it UPS ? - can I put it up
in the overhead compartment as a carry on (it has a Larrivee Deluxe hard
case) ? What are peoples experiences with this....; If I put it in a
flight box, its going to add quite a bit of money (like $80 I think)
each way, and then it might get lost as its checked luggage.

Thanks for any help..
-Ed Bianchi


From: Lumpy <lumpy@digitalcartography...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 01:50:47 -0700

Ed Bianchi wrote:
> I saw the post on Parlour guitars and airlines,
> and wanted to know how
> people handle full size guitars in a hard cases...

Here we go again -

Insure it ($26 annually for me).
Check it as regular baggage.
26,000 worry free freq flyer miles.

lump


From: Lumpy <lumpy@digitalcartography...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 07:04:37 -0700

Ed Bianchi wrote:
> ...insurance carrier you use?

> Sorry to bother you again lumpy...

I didn't mean to come across rudely, sorry.
I reread my post and it looked that way.

I did a google search for something like
'guitar insurance' and got several hits.
Ended up with -
http://www.musicproinsurance.com/

Minimum premium is $26 annual which covered
my Lowden. I now have 6 guitars and a Fender
Acoustasonic amp covered for (I think) $55.
A $100 deductable gives you full replacement
coverage. It even covers stuff like instruments
that people loan to you that get gobsmacked or
slickfingered while in your posession.

But perhaps the bigger picture is that I've
carried my Lowden in it's Hiscox lite-flight
case as regular checked baggage for all those
26K miles. It's never had a problem. Never even
gone out of tune. Used to do the same thing with
my Norman in it's el cheapo TKL or SKS case. It
too has never been winkboozled as checked baggage.

lumpy


From: Mark McDonald <mdm@sonic...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 05:41:38 GMT

Your best case scenario would be to put it in an overhead but you are likely
to encounter some resistance along the way. They are going to want to check
it, gate check it at the very least. Or you may be able to slide by
unnoticed. It is becoming a gamble. Certainly do the best not to call
attention to your guitar. Certainly pad the headstock and body in the case
so as to prevent "headstock whiplash" if the case gets dropped, or kicked
like a football. If you do carry it on don't carry anything else on. I
tend to ship UPS these days. It is more expensive but at least it is
insured. The airline won't pay you didley if they screw up your instrument.

--
Mark McDonald
<mdm@sonic...>
http://www.inlandproperties.com
707-545-3220>


From: Roscmorris <roscmorris@aol...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: 02 Sep 2001 10:22:19 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

When you buy the ticket ask for a seat in the rear of the plane if available.
The airlines always start general boarding from the rear forward so you will be
much more likely to find available overhead space. If you are sitting in first
class, they always give first class passengers the option to board at their
leisure, go first.

                                         Scott


From: David D. Berkowitz <ddb@berkowitzguitars...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 13:13:41 GMT

One thing you can do is wait to check the guitar at the gate. If you wait
until you're boarding and they tell you it has to be checked, it won't be
sitting on the tarmack heating up or getting banged around the luggage
handling system and it will be one of the last items in and first items out.
That's a help.

--

    David D. Berkowitz
    Berkowitz Guitars
    301 12th St, SE
    Unit 1
    Washington, DC 20002
    (202) 543-1806
    ddb@berkowitzguitars.com
    http://www.berkowitzguitars.com


From: Greg Thomas <gjthomas@earthlink...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 14:40:57 GMT
Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net

A lot of advice here, Ed. Part of the equation is the airport you'll be
flying out of. At Denver International, e.g., you're probably not going to
get far with something as large as a guitar. It's rare that you can pass
through security with it. Something to consider.

Greg


From: Lumpy <lumpy@digitalcartography...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 08:30:38 -0700

Greg Thomas wrote:
> ...Part of the equation is the airport you'll be
> flying out of. At Denver International, e.g.,
> you're probably not going to get far with
> something as large as a guitar. It's rare
> that you can pass through security with it...

Very good point. Some airports seem to be better
at handling guitars, I've found. Denver (and probably
other ski areas) has special equipment and storage
areas designed for skiis. Nashville does well with
guitars probably due to the obvious hi volume of
guitars it sees. Las Vegas and sometimes Los Angeles
require showing the baggage claim prior to leaving
the baggage area. I've yet to fly into any airport
(even Dallas) where I couldn't beat the luggage to
the carousel, unless I change planes last minute
and the guitar preceeds me on another flight.

Chicago Midway, LaGuardia, Newark suck at just about
everything, including guitar handling.

lumpy


From: Unsung96 <unsung96@aol...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: 02 Sep 2001 16:22:11 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

<< A lot of advice here, Ed. Part of the equation is the airport you'll be
flying out of. At Denver International, e.g., you're probably not going to
get far with something as large as a guitar. It's rare that you can pass
through security with it. Something to consider.

Greg >>

Not a piece of cake - but I've seen a J-200 in case get carried on at Denver.
of course the carrier was much prettier than me.


From: Reid Kaplan <reidkaplan@hotmail...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2001 16:42:17 +0000 (UTC)
Organization: Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

"Ed Bianchi" <<ebianchi@enounce...>> wrote in message
news:<3B91A90A.B4F7E58B@enounce...>...

> Hello all, I have not posted in a while, but need some advice..
>
> I saw the post on Parlour guitars and airlines, and wanted to know how
> people handle full size guitars in a hard cases...
>
> I will be flying across the USA in a little while, and want to bring my
> good guitar (a Larrivee LV-10). Should I send it UPS ? - can I put it up
> in the overhead compartment as a carry on (it has a Larrivee Deluxe hard
> case) ? What are peoples experiences with this....; If I put it in a
> flight box, its going to add quite a bit of money (like $80 I think)
> each way, and then it might get lost as its checked luggage.

I know Fred is an expert, because an FA. But, let me tell you there is
extreme variation between airlines and even between flights on the
same line.
A set of 3 multi leg experiences by 5 of us recently were highly varied.

Andy Wang and Lynette went Continental to HNL from Newark. They gate
checked
one full size case and got their parlor in the cabin. The FAs were
confused
about where to pick up the guitar (and that of 5 others) at HNL. All of
a
sudden, the guitars appeared at the cabin door. On the return, they got
both
in the cabin.

John Thomas took a multihop on TWA to the Pacific NW from NY. Gate
checked
every leg and got it back at the cabin door each time, unhurt.

Sarah and I flew UAL from BDL to ITO (Hilo). At check in at BDL, the
counter
guy told us it was not possible to gate check. We insisted and did it.
At the
SFO layover, the FAs said they would come to the cabin door, but the
"Service"
Rep, said regular baggage carousel. After lots of waiting and hunting,
they
came out at last in "ODD SIZE BAGGAGE" - The Caltons were chipped and
scuffed.
Same at HNL. Aloha was a UAL code share from HNL to ITO. They gate
checked and
returned them to cabin door before we got out of our seats and they were
handled
gently. Almost the same on the returns, except at BDL, they came out on
regular
carousel. More case dings.

So, UAL sucks, Continental is confused, Aloha and TWA do the right
thing.

Moral: believe it when it happens and buy a sacrificial Calton.

               ...Reid
--
Posted from 1cust13.tnt11.norwalk.ct.da.uu.net [65.231.77.13]
via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG


From: Bob Dorgan <dorgan@fltg...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 13:57:52 -0400
Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com

Unsung96 wrote:
>
> Reid Kaplan wrote::
> << (snip) After lots of waiting and hunting,
> they
> came out at last in "ODD SIZE BAGGAGE" - The Caltons were chipped and
> scuffed. >>
>
> But this is why you shell out the bucks for these cases in the first place -
> correct? I agree it's hard to see your 500 dollar case chipped but.....
> People even buy covers for the cases.

Exactly.
I've flown 3 times with my Goodall and have never gotten through
security with it to even gate check it.
It was in a Calton so I just checked it as regular baggage. The case is
starting to look pretty scuffed but the guitar has not been damaged.
Money well spent as far as I'm concerned.
Bob Dorgan


From: Adrian Legg <commercial-free@speech...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2001 19:55:46 +0000

On Sun, 2 Sep 2001 16:56:02 +0000, Unsung96 wrote
(in message <<20010902125602.01545.00003568@mb-ci...>>):

> [....] I agree it's hard to see your 500 dollar case chipped but.....
>[...]

They fix up ok with car body filler.

--
www.adrianlegg.com


From: aerie <aerie01@sprynet...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: Sun, 2 Sep 2001 13:47:13 -0400
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises

Hi Ed,

Recently, a friend of mine had his Larrivee utterly destroyed by an airline
who shall remain nameless (but aka AirTran). All of the binding along one
of the sides popped, which can only mean that the case was dropped from a
good distance. If I didn't have a Calton or Mark Leaf case, I wouldn't even
consider flying with either of my guitars.

BTW -- AirTran DID pony up the bucks for the guitar and it was repaired, but
of course, it will never be the same.

Just my $0.02.

Ann

Ed Bianchi wrote in message <<3B91A90A.B4F7E58B@enounce...>>...
>Hello all, I have not posted in a while, but need some advice..
>
>I saw the post on Parlour guitars and airlines, and wanted to know how
>people handle full size guitars in a hard cases...
>
>I will be flying across the USA in a little while, and want to bring my
>good guitar (a Larrivee LV-10). Should I send it UPS ? - can I put it up
>in the overhead compartment as a carry on (it has a Larrivee Deluxe hard
>case) ? What are peoples experiences with this....; If I put it in a
>flight box, its going to add quite a bit of money (like $80 I think)
>each way, and then it might get lost as its checked luggage.
>
>Thanks for any help..
>-Ed Bianchi
>
>


From: Jeff Hart <jhart@ipass...>
Subject: Re: Airlines and guitars..
Date: 2 Sep 2001 19:44:38 -0700
Organization: http://groups.google.com/

have only flown with a good guitar once (gibson j-100xta) but it made
it from raleigh-durham, connected to miami and on to the st. thomas
without being asked to be checked as baggage (american airlines). i
carried it on each step of the way. a couple of the 6 legs of the
trip, it had to be stowed in the cabin closet. i do feel i was lucky
though after reading some of the reports here about not being able to
carry on. i have realized that i do not play as much as when i'm
home, so now i have a backpacker and i just carry it on. if i were
traveling to a gig, in the future, i would probably consider getting a
flight case.

jeff

http://www.jeffhartweb.com

Ed Bianchi <<ebianchi@enounce...>> wrote in message news:<<3B91A90A.B4F7E58B@enounce...>>...
> Hello all, I have not posted in a while, but need some advice..
>
> I saw the post on Parlour guitars and airlines, and wanted to know how
> people handle full size guitars in a hard cases...
>
> I will be flying across the USA in a little while, and want to bring my
> good guitar (a Larrivee LV-10). Should I send it UPS ? - can I put it up
> in the overhead compartment as a carry on (it has a Larrivee Deluxe hard
> case) ? What are peoples experiences with this....; If I put it in a
> flight box, its going to add quite a bit of money (like $80 I think)
> each way, and then it might get lost as its checked luggage.
>
> Thanks for any help..
> -Ed Bianchi

Flying with a Guitar
From: CHRISSTERN <chrisstern@aol...>
Subject: Re: Flying with a Guitar
Date: 05 Sep 2001 23:44:03 GMT
Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com

Flew over here to England 2 weeks ago with my Olson SJ, Martin OM42PS and my
Taylor Big Baby in it's gig bag. Virgin took them ALL from me a the gate and
they reappeared on the carousel in Manchester. This is most probably because
overhead bins in a 747 won't (in my experience) take a guitar case. This is
different to smaller jets.
So I'd try to fly on a 757 or 767 or Airbus. I had no difficulty with Delta
last year when I carried the OM42PS all the way on 3 flights from Jax to Man.

Chris


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